Then and Now: Chipping Away Without a Plan
A few years ago I highlighted this beautiful building as one that must be saved.
Since then some work has been done on the building. Not the kind of work you would hope for, however. Its beautiful roof overhangs have been removed and temporary water-proofing wrap was installed. Just prior to this work, a portion of the roof had fallen off the building. Other than the "improvement" this valuable piece of Buffalo's heritage continues to rot away.
Will this be the next Livery? Probably not. The building, St Vincent's Orphanage, sits on Riley Street just one block east of Main Street. This is not the kind of neighborhood were neighbors come out to save a building. It is not the kind of neighborhood were people with clout will cash in a favor to make a difference. This building sits out of sight, out of mind, rotting bit by bit each day.
Is there a plan to save it? Or will this be another loss?
Before you remind me that this is the east side and that there is no hope to bring back a gang-ridden slum, take a look at the houses directly across the street. Should we tell these people to pack it in, that their neighborhood is worthless?
Before you remind me that this building can never be useful again remember that the adjacent Squier House was successfully renovated even after demolition was started and halted by "obstructionists" and that the Packard Building across the street is currently being renovated. Remember that ArtSpace is just a few blocks south. Remember that beautiful Linwood Avenue is just 2 blocks away and that Elmwood is only 5 blocks away.
Why is this valuable piece of Buffalo's irreplaceable urban heritage rotting away? Because there is no plan. Can you hear the sound of chipping? Chip! Chip! Chip! Once it is gone, it can not come back.
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Comment Options
MikeJ
I totally agree with you Steel...but the location isn't as rosey as you make it out to be, one block East of Main is the biggest divide in the city. This is a beautiful building, but what could it be used for? There are no colleges around to make it lofts for students or young professionals. Condo conversion is out of the question, office space?...no. There is NO economical use for this building at this point in time. I think the city (if it owns the building) should moth ball it and for future use. No developer that can afford the building AND the huge capital needed to renovate it wont even ask what the asking price is.
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ToughintheStreets
Maybe we should try to save this one now instead of the day of its scheduled demolition. That way it WONT be like the Livery. Plus then we can avoid the thrice daily posts about it.
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Sal
This building has been up for sale as long as I have been in business which is about 16 years. I was at the auction where the entire property sold for $1,000. That included the Squire Mansion, a brick gym building and the St. Vincent's Orphanage building.
What do you want done to this place? What is your plan?
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sbrof
It is a shame that there is no plan or even database of these structures worth saving.
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wizardofza
"This is not the kind of neighborhood were neighbors come out to save a building."
Then ultimately what makes this neighborhood worth saving?? If the people living there don't give a shit and there is no economic impulse to revitalize such places then what's the point?
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skarnath
A few developers have looked at the building, and have said that right now, it's too expensive and too risky. But Artspace chose the Buffalo Electric Car Company building in order to stimulate development in the surrounding area and to build a bridge between the east and west sides of Buffalo. Despite a few stumbles, it seems to be working. Regan Development was recruited from Westchester County and looked at both the Packard Building & St. Vincent's. They decided that it made more economic sense to go with the Packard Building, but it still took them 18 months (& lots of pain) to put together the financing.
The best way to save St. Vincent's is to convince the City to make it a development priority. They need to market it as a development opportunity, and they need to reach out to developers outside of the area. They also need to put together a laundry list of available subsidies, because the costs will be so high that it can't be done without subsidies. One approach would be for the City to put together a Request for Proposals from developers, and have the developers tell the City the depth and variety of subsidies they would need to make the project work. The reality is that as much as developers are happy to work on projects that also contribute something important back to the community, the project still has to be financially viable - from a market, development cost, and operating budget perspective.
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Quinn
ToughintheStreets - How many times must it be said? the neighbors were very active about the Livery BEFORE the demolition. You just didn't hear about it until the press surrounding the demolition. Which speaks to Steel's larger point - a need for a plan.
There have been lots of posts on this subject. All the ideas need are strong charismatic leadership to get them rolling because the City is not going to do it. Private citizens seem to offer better solutions in this City.
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reflip
This is a 5 minute walk from the Utica subway station, right? UB graduate student housing?
If Main Street doesn't turn into "UB Way" connecting downtown to North Campus via public transportation, then Main Street is going to remain as-is forever. The way I see it, a strategic injection of UB students is the only hope.
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magnum
Great proactive article to help keep attention on this issue. ty
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Metropolis
One of my favorite buildings in Buffalo.
I forsee this being remodeled in the next 3-5 years (condos/possibly a school) if the Main Utica corridor improves and Packard is a success.
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Quinn
ToughintheStreets - How many times must it be said? the neighbors were very active about the Livery BEFORE the demolition. You just didn't hear about it until the press surrounding the demolition. Which speaks to Steel's larger point - a need for a plan.
There have been lots of posts on this subject. All the ideas need are strong charismatic leadership to get them rolling because the City is not going to do it. Private citizens seem to offer better solutions in this City.
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Metropolis
One of my favorite buildings in Buffalo.
I forsee this being remodeled in the next 3-5 years (condos/possibly a school) if the Main Utica corridor improves and Packard is a success.
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benfranklin
I disagree with the characterization of the neighborhood. While attending an auction for a property on Riley within the last two weeks, I spoke with a number of these homeowners. One of the pictured homes has been occupied by the same family for 60 years.
While these residents have maintained their homes, no one seems willing to step in and invest new money in the neighborhood. I agree with the thrust of the article, but don't think any blame can be hung on the neighbors. They're no more at fault for the plight of this building than any other residents of the city.
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jsk1983
Its less than a mile from Canisius, although I'm not sure they'd want that much of a gap between there campus and student housing or whatever could possibly be put into it.
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livesintheburbsworksinthecity
I think Canisius is focused on the immediate blocks surrounding the current campus, I doubt they'd be too interested in this building.
There is no shame in mothballing the place to protect it from further decay until it become economically prudent to develop the site.
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RaChaCha
I like skarnath's analysis, and especially his mention that the "Midtown" location for ArtSpace was a strategic choice. Chuck Thomas (now planning chief of My Fair City) has told me that he and others involved worked for the Midtown location to spur revitalization in that area, and followed up with the Midtown: Poised for Renaissance plan (great article about that and St. Vincent's here: http://fixbuffalo.blogspot.com/2006/03/midtown-masterpiece.html) to explicitly lay the groundwork for that.
It seems to me that the bet has paid off. I said to someone yesterday that revitalization of the section of Main Street from Summer/Best to Utica is like watching a film of dominoes falling, but run in reverse (I'd make an exception for the demolitions for Delta Sonic). With ArtSpace, Coe Place, the Ross Eye Institute (here: http://www.buffalorising.com/story/more_midtown_construction), the Packard, the Squire Mansion, the Buffalo Tourist Lodge site (here: http://www.buffalorising.com/story/midtown_momentum_continues), etc. rising in a row of revitalization - each project seeming to help nudge the next into getting off the ground.
The big question is, will St. Vincent's be the next domino to rise? And will that happen before the elements get it? My bet is yes!
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STEEL
Ben,
I am not casting blame on the residents of the neighborhood. The owner should be the person held accountable for the condition of any building. These people that have lived on this street have upheld their end of the bargain as citizens of Buffalo. They should not have to endure the neglect of a building like this. They should not have to mount a protest to save the unique heritage of their neighborhood either. What I meant to say is that there are likely fewer people on the east side with the means and interest in saving buildings like this
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sonyactivision
There are possibilities for this building, not all of them profit-making. Senior housing comes to mind which means either public money or subsidies and tax abatements. Apartments could happen as well, but I wonder how receptive those neighbors in those nice houses would be towards low income units here. Market rate lofts, condos or apartments seem remote but if ArtSpace is successful, what's to stop someone from doing similar in this building? The city needs to gin up the entire East Side by lavishing tax breaks and abatements on the area. Why not?
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GDC
Did I miss something, i could of sworn that BRO posted a story recently on how this property was going to be turned into new living spaces. What happend? Did the developer change its mind?
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mmiller
GDC, that was a story on the German Catholic Orphanage:
http://www.buffalorising.com/story/st_martins_village_project
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manski
sonyactivision, if a 'possibility' is not profit-making then usually it's pretty hard to find an investor for it. A private investor at least.
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sonyactivision
You're right, manski, which is why I brought up the "public money" aspect. Not all redevelopment is privately financed and something like this building may have to be publicly financed. But that's not a bad thing because if the area stabilizes and gentrifies, that public entity could always sell to a private investor at a profit. Who knows?
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Biniszkiewicz
The location gets better by the day. It's very close to downtown, very close to a subway station, next door to the Packard and down the block from Artspace. If your children attend City Honors or Performing Arts or Canisius or Narden you are right in the neighborhood. This could be developed to appeal to eco-conscious artsy families or seniors (though I think there's a surplus of senior housing) or young professionals, etc. Your immediate neighbors (Squire, Packard, soon to be restored 1291 Main) are going to be looking very good for decades to come. Not everyone is afraid of an urban setting.
Regan first had this building under contract because he loved the architectural detail of it so. But as he began getting rehabilitation estimates, he switched his focus to the Packard building instead. The costs of rehab for the Packard were much more easily definable as compared to St. Vincent's (though the Packard was more expensive to purchase than St. Vincent's; Cash hadn't intended to vacate the Packard and it is larger).
A few years ago a charter school (Maritime) had this under lease, but Cash could not get financing to build it out. This building served as part of ECC City as late as 1980 or '82, I believe.
The haircut of removing the overhang is very unfortunate. Likely anyone redeveloping this building would require Historic Tax Credits as part of the gap financing. If that is the case I'm thinking the developer would be required to recreate the overhangs. There are plenty of pictures showing what they looked like.
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skarnath
I agree with RaChaCha that this building will be saved. The major questions for me are: when, by whom, & for what re-use purpose?
A few miscellaneous comments - 1) St. Martin Village project could have been funded in the recently announced tax credit awards by the state Division of Housing. A mix-up in communication at City Hall prevented it from being listed as one of the City's top 2 priorities for funding. 2) the housing bill signed by the President yesterday fixed almost every major problem with Section 42 of the IRC (the affordable housing tax credits), including the "general public use" requirement. The IRS had said that Artspace could not create an artist preference in their marketing and rent-up, thus jeopardizing all of Artspace's projects. The bill makes the artist preference legal. 3) Both Artspace & the Packard use a combination of federal & state housing credits, as well as historic preservation credits. The state housing credits are particularly helpful in developing mixed-income housing, because they allow developers to rent to families up to 90% of area (i.e. county) median income. Current median income in Erie County for a family of 4 is $60,900 - 90% of that is $54,810. The result is that almost all families in the city that are interested in renting are income-eligible for the state credit units, and many are eligible for the federal credit units, which have a 60% income requirement.
So it's certainly possible to use the same formula -a combination of historic and housing credits - on St. Vincent's that was used for Artspace & the Packard Building.
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Colin
I think it's a mistake to try and "gin up the entire east side." A lot of the east side is gone, most likely for good. The city needs to get more strategic in its approach to east side development. A great way to do that is to focus on areas like this, relatively close to Main.
What can people actually do to help save this building?
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skarnath
Colin - in no particular order: 1) lobby the city to make it a development priority, with appropriate subsidies; 2) find a developer willing to buy it and do something with it. The City's assessment rolls show it as still owned by Bailey Robinson, Inc. From Bob Biniszkiewicz comment, they are willing to sell; 3) keep it in the news. This post helps.
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btal
What a great-looking building!
I think it would do well as UB grad student housing. It would be even better if it weren't *actually* affiliated with UB, but promoted to the grad student population. If it's near the Utica metro stop, that's a huge benefit for low-income students who want to live in the city (particularly near Elmwood) but find it nearly impossible to get to UB without a car. Plus, I think a good percentage of grad students would be really interested in living in a creepy old orphanage...myself included. No joke :)
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btal
What a great-looking building!
I think it would do well as UB grad student housing. It would be even better if it weren't *actually* affiliated with UB, but promoted to the grad student population. If it's near the Utica metro stop, that's a huge benefit for low-income students who want to live in the city (particularly near Elmwood) but find it nearly impossible to get to UB without a car. Plus, I think a good percentage of grad students would be really interested in living in a creepy old orphanage...myself included. No joke :)
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RaChaCha
I've always been a fan of the charter school idea for this building. Just an elevator ride from your office is a veritable nest of heroic - and brainy - building savers and charter school advocates - perhaps Buffalo Rising could play matchmaker between them and this building--?
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allfit
Btal - That isn't a bad idea, given the proximity to the BNMC; but it is probably going to require further gentrification of the surrounding streets. The surrounding area is no joke, take a stroll along Main St from Glenwood (Birchfields) to Best, or from the Utica Station to the Allen / Medical campus station and see how you feel when it is over, especially later in the evening. The BMHA projects are just a few blocks away from the old Orphanage, a great place for college students to score some study aids but not the place that you want to walk through every night on your way to class. It is a good idea, but it might take some time to come to fruition, sort of like the ideas for the Bethune Building.
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Assaroni
OBSOLETE, is the only word that comes to mind regarding this bldg...as nice as it is...
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rydog71
Nice article STEEL. This what BRO should be about and not articles complianing the Wilson Farms didn't ask for Newel's approval before starting their renovations. Thanks for keeping it real.
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buffaloweiner
If Artspace is SOLD OUT, then I have to agree that it makes sense to expand the success of Artspace into St Vincents and even Our Lady of Notre Dame
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