Buffalo Rising Online

oh I wish people would get over UB Amherst. The biggest problem with both UB Amherst and Buffalo State is parking which could easily be solved via light rail extensions.

There is a bigger point now and that point is how can UB best utilize these buildings and these 3 campuses. Especially when there is a possibility of a 4th campus possibility if their NanoResearch turns into a 2nd Center for Excellence.

Its possible but I dont see University transitioning into a small business incubator/research center...though it is closer to its partner over at Buffalo State.

The bigger question might be returning undergraduate and graduate liberal arts to the University District or just graduate. It depends on how cleanly non-business and non-technical programs can be separated but the limiting factor is that some programs like journalism, law, architecture have natural affinities with downtown.

The other option is to move all administrative offices and centers off Amherst to University which would free up space at Amherst.

but our local colleges and universities are major engines of growth and we need to help them to partner together and grow so our city and region can grow with them.

A consortium that includes Niagara University, NCC, ECC, Trocaire, Daimen, D'Youville, Canisius, Buffalo State, Medaille, St Bonaventure, and colleges inthe southern tier down to Corning.....heck if we could partner with Ithaca/Corning then maybe Buffalo would be a potential site for expansion of GLW-Corning Glass Works.

UB made Amherst, in the 60's there was very little developement past Sheridan and Niagara Falls Blvd.. Amherst was and is the beneficiary of a huge investment of taxpayer dollars. Just another example of subsidizing the suburbs at the expense of the city.

heathersmiles...I really look forward to your posts. They are great!

heathersmiles...I really look forward to your posts. They are great!

That decision 40 years ago is considered to be the biggest mistake ever made in WNY. UB would have stabilized the city from which it originated. It would have brought the same level of wealth to Buffalo that Amherst likes to pretend it "created". Reminds me of the quote about George Bush being born on third base and thinks he hit a triple, just plug in Amherst instead of George. The subsidies for Erie Basin, HSBC Arena, etc benefit the REGION and Buffalo is the Regions center.and it was not "fierce opposition" from city residents, it was more business and political interests that opposed UB.

buffalo was intact when those decisions were made. the population of tonawanda, amherst, cheektowaga, hamburg, orchard park, east aurora, lancaster.....

the businesses were still in buffalo & these people were still in buffalo and the civil rights riots, bussing, integration, etc hadnt made people want to flee

of course they didnt want urban renewal and demolition in their community

decision was made....now UB is coming back with a 3rd campus & possibly a 4th

buffaloweiner- it wasn't integration that ruined Buffalo. Political forces played a much greater role in moving the population out of the cities. VA mortgages, Subsidized highways, and redlining of city neighborhoods did much more damage than any "civil rights" advocates.

1. There's a bit of a difference between government spending that helps shore up an already-existing city and government spending that essentially creates a brand new city in the middle of nowhere. So it's hardly hypocritical to criticize the decision to build UB in Amherst while supporting subsidies for city projects. One supports sprawl, while the other supports density.

2. That said, North Campus exists and that's never gonna change. And UB is still a huge asset to the region, including the city. Investing in that asset makes sense.

BRL and Colin - The five stages of grief are:

1. Denial: * Example - "the city is thriving, look at all the development that is taking place"

2. Anger: * Example - "We would be doing so much better if it wasn't for those dang suburbs, they took our jobs!"

3. Bargaining: * Example - "We aren't as bad as Detroit, as long as we are better than Detroit we are doing alright"

4. Depression: * Example - "what's the point, this place is doomed, we all suck, the suburbs have everything and we are left with nothing. I am going outside to eat worms"

5. Acceptance: * Example - "Things will be alright, we aren't the same city we were 60 years ago and we can accept that. We are not in competition with the suburbs, we complement each other. We need the suburbs and they need us, so let's work together to improve the image of the city so people will visit here more often. Let's take an objective assessment of our strengths and weaknesses and work at improving both. Build on our strengths and work on improving our weaknesses. Don't focus on what we don't have, but start to build on what we do have. "

We will get better, if we let ourselves get better.

UB made Amherst, why do you think it is the largest and one of the wealthiest suburbs of Buffalo. The wealth generated by the UB campus is so big it is hard to quantify. If these dollars were spent in the city we would not be suffering and the region would ultimately benefit.

BRL - That sounds exactly like Heather's comment... weird.

Dr.allfit- uncomfortable truths seem to upset you.

blackrocklifer - Shouldn't you direct some of your hate toward upscale neighborhoods in Buffalo? Based on your view, aren't they screwing over Black Rock even more than Amherst is? Sure they pay city property taxes. Big deal. Don't a lot of them drive their expensive cars away from Buffalo to shop in Amherst malls and the Galleria? They take more than their fair share of police protection. If someone from Nottingham or Middlesex call the cops don't you think the response is better than if someone in Black Rock does? How's that fair? Their housing is better too. Many of them send kids to private schools. Much inherited wealth on those streets. Probably on some much higher than most streets in Amherst. Where's the fairness? They can buy you off with a few thousand per year in property taxes? Talk about being born on third base - they inherit all that wealth and get the benefit of living in low cost Buffalo!

And what about that decision 150 years ago to build the art gallery in the Delaware District instead of in Black Rock? Wasn't that like stealing from Black Rock? When it was built, that part of Elmwood was mostly undeveloped much like Millersport in the 1960s, but Black Rock was a village long before that. The art gallery could have easily been put in Black Rock. Why isn't anyone asking what political interests were involved? It was only 150 years ago. Maybe at least from now on any expansion of the art gallery should be in Black Rock for fairness and regionalism within the city.

How about those nice rich houses on Oakland Place? Some much fancier than many houses in Amherst. Yet their owners keep them off limits to Buffalo's poor. No free or reduced price lunches going to children in those mansions. Shameful. Amherst at least has the decency to come close to the national average for percent of poor children. I wonder what's the percent on Middlesex or Nottingham. Probably zero. Why aren't they getting any of your attention here?

Blackrocklifer - I was thinking the same thing about you. The truth hurts, doesn't it.

I know you have a vested interest in our future but don't let that passion blind you.

allfit --

1. I don't get why you've addressed your post to me. Read what I wrote -- I argue that although the decision was a mistake, it can't be taken back and investing in UB is good for the region.

2. That said, I think your fifth point is wrong. To begin with, the city is in competition with the suburbs. They compete for residents, for instance. When someone buys a home in Orchard Park rather than Buffalo, the city suffers. They compete for the best new teachers. They compete by creating IDAs to lure businesses away from one another.

3. None of this is a judgment of those who live in the suburbs. And it would be great if the region could work together as a whole, particularly by getting rid of the silly borders. But it seems obvious that the creation of the suburbs materially harmed the city.

hilaritee - Is it that strange for a BR post to not have a clear reason or topic sentence? They want to post a few times a day. I bet that's not easy without a paid staff or a very dedicated volunteers.

Elena's article at least has reasoned balance compared to how Buffalo Rising has often blogged about UB. She didn't complain about the Amherst decision 40+ years ago. She didn't flame about architecture. She doesn't do silly complaining about UB's sensible decision to put a new engineering building close to their existing facilities for engineering, math, and sciences.

Maybe Elena really has a different attitude about UB than QueensEyes. Or maybe very cynical readers might wonder if Buffalo Rising is trying to sign UB as an advertiser and skipped negativity this time for that reason. No matter the motive, it's possible BR readers wanting an update about UB without the usual complaining might find her article informative. My guess is there's no sneaky reason for the article if that's what you're implying. Probably just a need for daily content and it's a topic they hadn't blogged much about except for complaining or demanding they build anything new in the city.

Colin - or you could look at this from a regional perspective and work on collaboration instead of competition.

Colin - Competition for residents is a positive in most ways by far, and for businesses it's a positive except when there's funny business about IDA deals. The whole IDA concept is more negative than positive. Job creation targets are b.s. because business should be expected to try to have as few workers as possible. The Hoyt-sponsored union rules for IDA projects are a big setback too. I say just eliminate all IDAs in NY state and whatever businesses leave the state because of it just accept it. If that was done, then if a business moves from Buffalo to O.P. or vice versa, we'd know it's because that's what the business wants to do. Same thing with Empire Zones. Eliminate them totally.

naw the truth is that Buffalo could have rebuilt.

60% of Buffalo has been demolished and is empty land. Think about that...

Buffalo like niagara falls embraced urban renewal and demolished large swaths of its urban neighborhoods. Nearly everything between the niagara river and niagara street was demolished for urban renewal....that was our canal community.

Look at exchange, Seneca, Swan, North&South Division all demolished for urban renewal....look at the eastside pot marked from demolition.

Its not just that the suburbs were new and cheaper and white...its that the city has never solved the problem of new development whether residential or commercial or industrial.

Instead of rowhouses...they build suburban farm houses

If they built 250k-500k houses in a neighborhood that emulated the neighborhoods surrounding delaware park there would be competition and choices. There is no reason why there shouldnt be proposals for south park, cazenovia, humboldt, front and Masten like there are for Delaware and LaSalle.

But thats just about the city/suburban issue. I guess I dont really understand the point because UB has gotten the message. It now has a 3rd campus downtown with potential to bring other non-medical programs like journalism, law, architecture and performing arts.

There is even the possibility of a 4th campus for Nanosciences if it emerges into a Center for Excellence.

The biggest problem is figuring out what to do with University campus but thats going to be an ongoing dialogue for sometime. I have more of a complaint with Buffalo State than UB. Atleast UB is trying (sometime kicking and screaming) to grow. (deleted).

"I don't remember who it was, but someone here once used an analogy of a house with a big gaping hole in the living room wall letting the rain and wind in and your heat out. Would you fix it? Or would you just stop using that room and build an addition on to the back of your house and start living there instead?"

I've used it before...along with seperating each room in the house based on function and surounding it with parking lots because we love our cars and the "freedom" they bring. That would work well too with the above scenario....of that old kitchen across the yard...thats not my responsibility...we use this new kitchen ;)

Erie county is one big house. The foundation is crumbling, the first floor is showing water damage and yet we are adding on to the second floor. We then wonder why our household expenses are so high and the region as a whole is undesireable and not sellable.....but hey!, my bedroom is on the second floor.....the second floor is doing things right!....lose the delusion and the area as a whole may grow.

If not for the unfortunate budget problems that SUNY is having, I think the UB Center for the Arts could have made a fabulous move by purchasing the Studio Arena building. Much like the Kavinvoky Theatre out of D'Youville, Studio Arena could have continued putting on shows under the umbrella of the University at Buffalo. And imagine the learning experience for theatre, dance, and even music majors! Having direct access to a LORT B theatre within your program would have shot UB's Theatre/Dance program to the top of many lists. This would have also helped to preserve the side-mission of Studio Arena as an educational company - and the Studio Arena folks could save money by holding those classes in conjunction with the university. Don't get me wrong: the UB Center for the Arts is probably a far more modern and capable facility for theatrical production, however having that intimate connection with Studio Arena would mean the world to students, getting them in on the ground floor (rather, the stage floor!) of one of the region's most professional theatre organizations.

cvp, UB used to own the old Pfeifer Theater, which is now the Town Ballroom.