Buffalo Rising Online

Not to steal thunder, but unfortunately an overall downturn in the Real Estate industry will increase a foreclosure rate. Those firms that focus heavily on foreclosures such as Polis, Cash Realty, and S.A.W. Commission Cutters will benefit in terms of number of transactions. Ranking Real Estate firms by transactions seems very misleading, especially when evaluating the health of the city's Real Estate climate.

If homes in Buffalo are selling fror less than $20,000.00 per transaction as seems to be the case in looking at the numbers for Cash Realty, how can that be a healthy assessment? Now the average price per transaction for Polis, would appear to be higher ($70.000.00??) if this story is accurate, which could not be determined by the Business First article since they did not disclose gross sales there.

However, when compared to those types of transactions to Hunt's numbers, where the average home sale price appears to be over $125,000.00, it's not even close. Hunt also has a strong presence in the city.

Real Estate is tricky when you factor in foreclosures, HUD, and investor flipping. Those will skew transaction figures

I'm glad to know more about Polis. It's great to have city enthusiasts who are knowledgeable about Buffalo and its neighborhoods. The situation in the city real estate market has come a long way from the early 1990's when there seemed to be a half dozen "For Sale" signs on every block of every street that were considered part of a "nice" neighborhood. In those days, city houses were only mentioned if a perspective buyer asked about them after getting the McMansion pitch for East Amherst, Clarence and Lancaster. I can't support my thoughts statistically, but I check the real estate sales in the BNews every Monday and I think that demand is pretty high for houses in "Good" neighborhoods. I've noticed prices that are rising on a fair number of streets and when I read, week after week, of houses on streets like Commonwealth, Sterling and Norwalk selling for over $100K, that indicates demand, at least to me.

I think Polis Realty is doing a great job. Not only are they doing a ton of city business but they have branched out to the suburbs as well. What you can see from the Business First article is that companies like Polis Realty had a near 20% gain in overall sales in 2006. The big 3 companies (Hunt, MJ Peterson, and RealtyUSA) reported net losses in sales. As these Real Estate dinosaurs decline, loose market share and become extinct, newer progressive companies like Polis are going to take over. This has been the trend for the past few years.

To comment on the above, somewhat negative view on Buffalo real estate: Fortunately for those of us who own property here - we have seen values increase slowly over the last few years, not rapidly like boom markets in California, Florida, Colorado, and Massachusetts, for example. Those places are seeing an increase in foreclosures as the market has dropped, or even just leveled. Purchasing in some of these markets was dependent, one could say, on record property value increases. In fact, economists have said that a full 25% of people's annual income in California was due to increasing equity in their homes. And this is now gone. Those markets are experiencing records foreclosure rates / statistics but are still below the levels of the S&L crisis in the 1980s (for those of who remember that). So locally, where does this put us? Better than the rest of them, I say. Sure, the market has slowed here, but I think that is healthy. Things are still selling. People from other places are seeing deals here (I wish more people from here would see deals here) and a market that is still relatively healthy compared to others where most project the bottom has not yet been reached. The prime areas of the city, I would say, still have a demand - supply is low. And as always, but now that the market has stabilized, the reason a house does not sell is the price. My point? Increasing foreclsoure rates nationally are not as great an impact on the local market - and certainly HUD values CANNOT be used as an indicator for the traditional market OR the private bank foreclosures as HUD is reselling the homes as the insurer on loans that had a substantial loss to the lender. That goes for any market. It should also be noted that the above comment from B-Lo (certainly a competetor in real estate) - makes somewhat negative light on focusing on foreclosures and sale price and the city - (one should also note that all real estate companies sell foreclosures - Hunt a a strong, good foreclsoure agent / division that actually does more than Polis - RealtyUSA recently called themselves "Western New York's largest foreclsoure company" or something close to that in a Buffalo News article - the list could go on). If you look at the numbers, and use HUD as a barometer, it would seem that overall, foreclosures are slightly down in WNY from previous years. It is also not a city problem - increasingly it is a suburban problem as also recently noted in the Buffalo News. The insinuation of the dollar volume amounts is also somewhat misleading - one an average sale price is essentially meaningless as averages are too easliy skewed - are are not true barometers. It is also misleading to say $20,000 is "not healthy" - I could alos say insulting. One must understand real estate in relation to the entire economic level of a region - in that, Buffalo is 5% below market as to what people can afford based on WNY incomes. Much better than places like Californian cities which were 35% overvalued as to what people could actually afford. That lead to interest only mortgages, no-document loans, anything so people could actually buy. Now that values are no longer going up in those places, foreclosures are. I would say, sure, houses are cheap in Buffalo when you compare them on par with the rest of the country, but not so cheap when one looks at salaries, etc. in the region. My point? Buffalo is affordable and affordable is good - regarless if you are looking for a 20,000 single or a 500,000 19th century mansion. The cheap shots directed at the company I won't debate only because I think such things are a waste of time (and also they are misinformed). The only thing I will say (as it burns me up) is that insinuations as to location and price of real estate has serious implications about class, economic ability and race. What is more problematic to me, is the several decades of abandonment of parts of the city by business and the city itself. Business moving back into blighted neighborhoods is the only way to build them back up - look at what is going on on Jefferson, for example - a new library, business incubator, bank, supermarket - they are serving a need AND helping to strengthen the area. What this little article was about (and thanks, Buffalo Rising - who should also, incidently - do a write-up about it's own incredible success) was about a small company in the city (now with a Williamsville office, too), working hard and seeing some success. That's good for everyone. As someone who started a business to have a way to stay here, I encourage everyone else to do the same thing, even if you go into real estate and compete with us. A moving economic engine is good for all of us. We need all kinds of small, local businesses to do that.

Well, to all those whose sense abilities were offended, I apologize for using "nice neighborhoods" in my post on Buffalo real estate. Let's substitute "market rate" for this antiquated and supposed code phrase. As far as quoting the recent sale prices of houses situated on the streets near the North Park Theater, if other residents of city neighborhoods feel that they are now priced out of the houses available there, I don't know what, exactly, I should say about that. I can understand their anger and disappointment but I don't think anyone benefits from avoidance of making these sale prices known. So, I'll try again-I believe that the current demand for houses in Buffalo neighborhoods where recent census data describe residents economically as above the city's median income is a reflection of robust demand. I used the recent sale prices of a couple houses in North Buffalo because their rate of appreciation from what the sale prices of houses on those same streets were 5 years ago again demonstrates demand.

I hated that period in the early 90's when there seemed to be a plague of "For Sale" signs all over the city. I really wondered for awhile whether this situation spelled the end of the city of Buffalo. This “plague” went on for several years until Masiello reconfigured the city's tax assessment rates. The reevaluation was followed by events like the Garden Walk that further spurred the return of the city real estate market. What I clumsily also tried to say was that during this period that I call the "For Sale" sign plague, there was such a disparity between the supply of city houses and the demand for them that even houses in the neighborhoods whose census data I just referred to weren't selling. Personally, I also think of this period as the nadir of Buffalo's recent real estate period. To have the kind of demand that now exists suggests how far this market has come.

One other point; anyone who knows me in Buffalo knows that I'm neither a racist nor a snob. I'm about 180 degrees away from diseased thinking like that. So please, no more inferences that I am.

sorry jstraubinger - i was not referring to your comments which were right on. You are right, increasing sales prices ARE good, demand is GOOD, and the revival of North Buffalo is a huge positive. (this is thanks in large part to a realtor we all know well who created a market there when there was none). i was referring the the previous comments that attempted to rank company by average sales price which was trying to make a company slam, but i think makes more a slam on location and class, than it does a particular company or business or sales person. everyone deserves to buy a home, regardless of price or income level. i should have clarified that. my only big regret is when i was here in the early 90s and houses were being given away, i didn't know enough about real estate, and was always complaining i was going to leave, so i never bought anything then. the GOOD thing about "being priced out" is it forces the "good" areas to expand into the rougher ones. those kind of market shifts are good - like the changes i mentioned on jefferson - those do not mean we are seeing a huge increase in sales price, but that the people who live there are slowly being able to enjoy a better lifestyle.

jmr-

I think you're reading way too much into a simple post as to point out how Business First ranks Real Estate firms. Since you assume to know that I'm a competitor, I guess I'll assume that you are part of the Polis team. To be clear, I never indicated that there was a downturn in Real Estate just in Western New York. I made a statement about the industry that makes the geographics irrellevent.

Furthermore, I hope you aren't taking the position that increased foreclosure rates is a good thing. Yes, I do put a negative light on that. While it's great that low home prices offer good deals for those looking to buy, it does reflect negatively on our current economy for those prices to be so dramatically low. That being said, how is having a economically supported opinion on the matter, insulting????

I've read the following posts several times to see what the heck you are taking about regarding class and race. Again, I can only conclude that you are reading WAAAYYYY into something there! No cheap shots at Polis were taken. The process of ranking Real Estate firms by Business First was simply questioned.

I'll put it this way. Realty firms whose gross revenue and average price per transaction are more impactful to the economy, as well as to consumers. I don't know about you, but if I'm to choose a Realtor to sell my home, I'm going with the one that I feel is best at getting the highest possible price for my home and provides the most comprehesive marketing and services. So, how else do you evaluate them then??

Polis is obviously doing a great job in their niche and is "feel good" storyline, because they are doing it "in the city". And correct me if I'm wrong, but they also focus heavily on the REO side which significantly helps the number of sides. Is it wrong to point out that a poor economic indicator (foreclosures) helps this positioning. I don't begrudge any Real Estate companies for handling this or any type of Real Estate transactions, I'm just opening the discussion as to whether or not other parameters would make more sense in this list. You dont' see very many other Biz First lists rank companies by transactions.

B-Lo - to continue our debate. Yes, I am part of Polis, as I previously stated. I would question BRO as a forum to debate the merits of Business First's methodologies, however. While I concur ranking by transactions is somewhat misleading - if you look at the list, ranking by dollar volume really wouldn't change the list that much. What I meant by discussing foreclosures, is that yes, there is a national trend of increasing foreclosure rates, but we are not experiencing it here - becuase we did not expeience the double digit inflation some markets experienced. While Buffalo often beats itself up for not being in line with the rest of the country, I'm saying sometimes there's something good about moving slowly. Rapid increases have led to rapid falls in other markets. A couple things back me up on this - this morning, yet another NPR report discussed foreclosures in California (someone referred to people's homes as ATM machines - which are now gone) and Forbe's saying Buffalo is the most afordable city in the country. I mentioned before the statistic that Buffalo real estate prices are only 5% below market - based on what people earn - what they can afford. Yes - it is cheap - but it is an economy that is in-line with itself. The comparison you made linking average sales prices to companies is more skewed than ranking by number of transactions ever could be, and I do honestly, still have a problem with linking a high price to an indicator of economic stability - and also with that, knowing the city and those markets stand by my previous statement. Overall, WNY had a good year for real estate, better on average than the rest of the State if you look at the Buffalo / Niagara Association of Realtors end of year report. That good year comes from being more stable than other areas of the country. As for us, you claim we are only there by selling foreclosures. Yes - we would have been number 5 this year without them - we are selling more traditional listings every year, and less foreclsoures are getting listed. That's good for us, and good for Buffalo. As to your argument that the one who makes the most money is better (I distilled that down) - let's not use this as a competive forum for listings. A real estate company who sells higher priced homes does nothing more for a community other than make more money for themselves (I wouldn't mind that). A slowly rising market IS GOOD for a local economy as that generates wealth. By focusing exclusively on hgiher priced that means that is your bsiness decision or, one might argue, you might be a bit of an elitist (or worse). I would argue, as I mentioned before, that abandoning the lower-priced areas of the city by the city itself and by business, had disasterous implications on our city. I'll stand by that, too. Listen - we sold 738 homes last year - you guys sold 6,498. I don't think you have that much to worry about - if you are, well, then we deserve a bigger pat on the back than a number on a list. There is plenty to go around for all of us and healthy competition is good for the consumer - in any business. I just went to the Mayor's address and he reminded everyone that 2006 was a great year for Buffalo - I don't mean to be corny - but there is alot going on in Buffalo right now that is really, really positive. Let's focus on that.

Again, you read too much into my remarks. Your assumtion is wrong, I do not work for Hunt. I was simply making an objective point. I still totally disagree with the fact that you seem to think home values are not a key indicator of economy strength. But just like buying and selling stock, you need to look at trends to determine if something is going to change. You keep referencing California. It's obvious that California has experienced a dramatic increase in home values during the "boom" to a point where it was grossly over -valued. That is why it is no surprise to anyone that they are very much adversly affected by this industry wide downturn.

There are a lot of key indicators here that Buffalo's Real Estate outlook is pretty good. One reason is that during the boom, we did not experience the same explosion as other parts of the country, therefore we certainly did not experience inflated home prices and dramatic fall out when interest rates started to rise.

Nevertheless, the evaluation of most companies still comes down to dollars and cents. Revenue and profits are the key indicators of company strength and success. Real Estate is no different no matter how many transactions it took to get you there

The only two properties that I recall Polis being involved with in Parkside area were two foreclosed properties. One of those properties had a pool that was not covered for the entire summer (creating a large stagnant mosquito breeding ground) and the front yard was only mowed when the front lawn and shrubs were seriously overgrown. Although I reported the open pool of water to Erie County Health Dept. nothing seemed to change. Sure that was the banks' responsibility to maintain the properties, but Polis certainly didn't seem to be helping its clients enhance the "livabliity of the city" or help them sell either property when the properties each lacked curb appeal. I hope these were the exceptions not the rule.

BuffaloRox first off I do work for Polis, in the last 2 year Polis has been involved 6 out of 68 transactions in the Parkside area and many more when you include North Buffalo as well as EV.

Parkview,

By your statistics Polis is a very small player in Parkside. Hunt is by far the dominant player in Parkside and the rest of North Buffalo (although I have no feelings one way or the other toward them). I can only reiterate that I and my neighbors were displeased at the way the house on Crescent with the overgrown lawn/shrubs and mosquito breeding grounds was marketed/maintained.

BR

BR Everyone is small compared to Hunt, ie Matt Q, in Parkside. The condition of the house on Crescent had more to do with the previous owner than Polis.

Parkview,

The continued lack of basic lawn/shrub care on the outside of the house on Crescent (including failure to prevent standing water) and lack of lawn/shrub care on a foreclosed property on Parkside made these houses look like eyesores. That had nothing to do with the former owners (who never let the lawn/yard look like crap). I understand the interior challenges of the Crescent house. The house on Crescent was also surrounded by houses with much higher values. It is the Polis Realty sign that is stuck in the middle of an overgrown front yard not the bank that is foreclosing. It is Polis and its reputation that becomes associated with those poorly kept properties.