Pitching downtown a different way.
What’s the first step in pitching development in a city? Identifying city-owned parcels of underutilized/vacant land, and ‘for-sale’ privately owned parcels. This master list of potential investment opportunities is just the first step in selling a city’s land portfolio. This concept (for Buffalo) was a brainchild of Bashar Issa who, along with the City Of Buffalo and Cannon Design, felt that it was important to understand the development opportunities on a larger scale. “If the city is to start selling the land that it owns, then investors should see the whole playing field," Bashar told me. "Up until now it was hard to visualize where the opportunities lay.â€
The groups also played around with different scale building scenarios to balance out the city’s ‘broken tooth’ skyline. I asked Bashar how the size and shape of the ‘ghost buildings’ were chosen and he explained, “Some properties are more valuable than others. We wanted to come up with a series of building scenarios to enhance the existing skyline. If the City starts to sell off some of their properties at a reasonable rate, then it should be expected (from the purchaser) that a one-story building would not be built there. If the developer agrees to making a major investment in Buffalo, then there is no reason not to sell the land at a reasonable price. If the developer does not come through within a specified time frame then he or she forfeits the land and is penalized for wasting the City’s time. These contracts are not uncommon in prosperous cities.â€
One of the reasons that Bashar is working with the City and paying for these types of studies is that he wants to make sure that his investment into Buffalo is a good one. He knows that if he can help to attract more development, then there will be businesses that would consider relocating (proximity to Canada, cost of living, etc.). Ultimately it will be the people returning to Buffalo that will be our biggest asset. Even though he did not say it, Bashar knows that his investment into the city will spark the interest of other developers. If he is prepared to discuss opportunities with interested parties, then a visual like the one you see here may be priceless.
*Note that the Buffalo City Tower and the new Federal Courthouse are included in the visual.
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Spaulding97
If only our skyline looked like that. Well who's gonna be the first to bash Issa this time? The guy is unbelievable, how can anyone say anything bad about him? He's from a different continent and he's done more for this city in less than two years, then the 50+ combined years of our administrators. People wake up, the guy is legit, stop being typical Buffalonians. He is taking drastic steps to improve our city.
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Dan
That's just wrong! This does not respect the vision of Joseph Ellicott, Frederick Law Olmsted, Frank Lloyd Wright, Stanley Makowski, Punch Imlach, Joey Reynolds, the Clutch Brothers, and Bishop Edward Head. Such plastic, artificial architecture may fit into a place like Toronto or New York, but it's absolutely out of place in a setting like downtown Buffalo. Think of the traffic those office towers would generate! Think of the views those buildings would block! Think of the architectural and historical integrity that would be lost when those fake glass and steel monoliths begin to mar Buffalo's hallowed skyline. Buffalo's gap-toothed skyline may not be dense like that of other cities its size, but it's certainly more honest, authentic and real.
I will not rest until all those monstrosities built downtown after World War II are demolished, and the Buffalo's skyline is returned to its rightful state.
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Spaulding97
^^^ Zing!!!
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WCPerspective
Reopening Genesee Street is a great idea, maybe in the next 50 years. I see the 'vision' removes the Skyway, too bad we can't ditch the 190 too. If only....
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hamp
I like that Bashar is doing this, it shows he's interested in improving the city. But, I think that there are better ways to spark development. I noticed that the rendering leaves the 190 thruway as is. Why not bury part of it and make the waterfront more accessible? That would attract development. I think developers will find the land when they're ready to invest. But first they've got to have tenants that want to be in a downtown that is attractive, convenient, and safe. Pretty renderings alone, aren't going to do it. We've seen plenty of them before.
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Keith
Dan that was great. You had me going there for a minute until I saw the picture/punchline. The city wasn't really that great looking back then, that's for sure.
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eyepharded
Dear Dan, most if not all of those people you mentioned are dead, therefore their visions are dead. Your point of view is what has been slowly killing this city for the past 50 years. If any one is willing to do anything for this city they should be welcomed with wide open arms. Unfortunatley a skyline that is "honest, authentic and real" does not provide jobs or help the city. The style of architecture is irrelevent. The fact that there is the possibility of any new architecture downtown at all is what is important. WWII ended a long time ago and this is a very different place now. Progress is coming so stay out of the way or pitch in. If you don't live in the city or at least work here (and i have no idea weather or not you do) then worry about your own town and hinder their attempts at progress. Build the tower, Build the casino, Build every damn thing that some one is willing to put here.
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Balth
Guys like Paladino should really take notes from Issa. Waiting for other people to develop their properties first, and then selling yours for a profit is no way to deveop Buffalo. Also, driving away other developers and making yourself the King of Buffalo does not work either. You need MANY people and developers for good competition. Heres where it gets tricky... theres no reason to demolish any more buildings because there are PLENTY of empty lots around downtown.
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Spaulding97
{Sarcasm mode on} What happened to the Aud!!?{Sarcasm mode off}
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RonR
WCP.
The 190 and the Skyway were the first two things I noticed as well.
Just imagine if downtown was connected to the water without the wall know as the 190.
Just imagine that not only the skyway was removed but the General Mills site was made into a park? What I have always found silly is when drawings are released for the outer harbor, the General Mills site is ALWAYS shaded out of view. What people have to realize is no hotel or housing is going to go up when this is the view. I say we ask GM to either move or leave. Hell it is only a matter of time before they do anyways.
Just imagine that isle turned into a park with walking bridges connecting it to downtown and to the outer harbor.
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bradon
Wow, a digital image of what Buffalo could look like if... well, if there was a need for all of these buildings, and a need for development of the surrounding structures.
Sorry to piss on your circle jerk, but I am still skeptical that he will deliver anything more than the designs and vision that he is currently producing. Maybe when you come down from your collective high, you might regain some rational sense. This guy is for real, and he will do some things for Buffalo, but for right now he is making promises that he cannot keep. We are acting like a girl being courted for the first time, we believe everything he says because "he is so wonderful".
Maybe we should change the name of the site to BRC Rising.
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BROKEEPSBLOCKINGME
WHAT ABOUT ALL OF THE BIRDS???? WE MUST PRESERVE THEIR MIGRATION! WHERES LIPPES? LETS FILE A LAWSUIT OVER THESE RENDERINGS!!!!!!
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MJWorthington
very original Blocking me....congrats on that brain storm.
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stephenjames716
godspeed issa
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Spaulding97
Brandon, how is he making promises that he can't keep?
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al-alo
ooo a sarcasm detector, thats a really useful invention!
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flyguy
Why would you want an active grain mill to be run out of town? General Mills is one of the last remaining operational mill and elevator in Buffalo and those elevators are actually useful on our waterfront as opposed to the decrepit ruins further up the Buffalo River. If anything that active mill is one of the most acurate features to preserve in that area being pitched as an Erie Canal tourism mecca. That area was elevators, ships, bars, brothels, blacksmiths, and boarding houses and if we are to take pride in the histoy of that area as we seem to be then we ought to keep one of the last pieces of that in place in General Mills When all others shut their doors General Mills still operated. Not to say that corporate America as it is in this day wouldnt shut it down tomorrow but I cetrainly wouldnt support kicking an operating plant out. This town has lost enough jobs and people over the last few decades, we dont need to lose more.
As for architecture I feel it is extremely important for cities to grow and change, they are dynamic places and as such should represent the many generations and eras of human kind including architecture. Whats wrong with having a downtown mixed with 19th, 20th, and 21st century examples of architectural style? Who are we to say what architectural style is best? I enjoy a diverse downtown, even that "ugly" city court building with the big slabs and no windows because it represents an era. Buildings like the ugly convention center are bad site decisions and I would say in those cases should be looked at for removal but restoring the skyline to its 1950's, 40's era state as "the way it should be" is wrong. Trying to live trapped in time, in some forgotten era isnt moving the area forward or keeping citizens and with less citizens and investment, less tax revenue and an ever smaller market the area will not be able to do anything progresively and proactively. Regressing to a former era and disregarding all current architecture and the architecture since WW2 is very bold . Preservation of the old must be done in collaboration with introduction of the new or the city will never change and the status quo doesnt work.
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MJWorthington
He even included some buildings around the BCT. Unlikely....but nice.
Best feature here, which we should be able to accomplish at some point with some foresight is the repoening of Genesee St. down to the water. Any connections of streets and greenspace tying it in would do wonders for dealing with the conitued existance of the 190. Genesee and Church as parkways looks great.
Why knock a guy for kicking his own money around and trying to market the area? If he fails, so what? At least he made an attempt without crying poverty and begging for governement money. I see actual movement and investment on the Statler. How's that work on the Dulski building coming along?
There may be a very small minority who may want everything done in 100yr ago style. But I think most are of the standpoint of perserving what we have and infilling with new builds that are designed for an urban area. Its a simple as that.
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jerkface
Dan, you made me spit water out of my nose.
Punch Imlach's vision for downtown needs to be respected! Someone tell Issa before he goes and ruins everything!
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RonR
Flyguy,
You make some good points but your points kinda make my case.
The General Mills is one of the last remaining operational mill and elevator in Buffalo! Which means it is on it's way out. The challenge is while it stays, it holds up development. Like I said before, no hotel is going to be built or residential complex is going to be built on the outer harbor as long as the view is of the plant. Sorry, but location, location location. A working plant is not something people want to live by. If you want further proof, count how many homes are near the plant today.
While the plant is useful TODAY, it will in time become another decrepit ruin like it's sisters up the river. General Mills is NOT going to grow in Buffalo. General Mills is NOT going to invest in the Buffalo plant. It is only a matter of time before General Mills leaves Buffalo. I say the city should either ask them to leave so the land can become part of the greater redevelopment project or ask them to move to an area that is not "PRIME" redevelopment land.
There is no such thing as the "Erie Canal tourism mecca" and there never will be. The Erie Canal project will be a nice add to the area and it will have a impact. But people are not going to come to Buffalo just to see a ditch and old grain elevators. This area will be a stop in a great collection of things. This area will not be the main destination.
The challenge with Buffalo is it holds on to its past so much that it is unable to enter into the future. I am not saying the grain elevators should be forgotten. But that does not mean we should keep them up to be remembered. A new museum with lots of pictures will do. By the way, I grew up in WNY and never once had these come up in my classes. Never once did I take a tour of an elevator. I would actually counter that they way we are currently remembering our past is the best way to ensure we forget it. An interactive museum on the water would do so much more. Just imagine a kid getting into a simulated ship and "scooping" like Irish men did 100 years ago. Just imagine an interactive display on how a grain elevator works and the beauty of its simplicity. These are things that are not done today. What is done today is looking at a rotting tower as you drive to the burbs on the 190.
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sally
General Mills WILL NOT INVEST here? REALLY? They are just wrapping up a $23 million plant improvement and modernization project!
Buffalo, NY – General Mills and the ECIDA are working together on a $1.2 Million rail improvement project at General Mills Buffalo plant. This project is part of a three year, $23 Million plant improvement plan at the General Mills Buffalo plant.
The Buffalo plant, located within a City of Buffalo Empire Zone, is one of the original grain milling operations dating from the early 1900’s. This plant is currently the 2nd largest grain milling operation and 3rd largest cereal producer for General Mills. Currently 450 full time employees work at the Buffalo facilities.
The rail improvement project will reconstruct 1,100 feet of track and build two new turnouts for plant operations. These improvements should help increase the present 7-10 rail cars and 110 truck movements per day at the facility. The project will also allow General Mills to use new type, high capacity, Pressure Aide grain cars.
http://www.ecidany.com/news.asp?ID=43
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sbrof
Really the best aspect of this design besides showing just how much of downtown in underdeveloped and out of the control of private developers is the reconnection of downtown to the waterfront. It shows that bashar and cannon paid attention to the Queen City Hub plan, that they are looking out for their own as well as the cities and every citizens best interests. It reinforces Ellicott, Olmsted and the Water as the bones that built our city and made it great. If I might make a suggestion, to reinforces and bring Erie Street from Main Street right to the water as another major connection and development opportunity.
Great brainstorming and wonderful sketch concept. The truth is we (planners) can "talk" to politicians all we want and have been for years but until you give them images like this that show what could be IF they would actually make some strong decisions, then you can never actually reach them and get things done. Good job in putting a good image to the ideas of the Queen City Hub and those of us who have been fighting this fight.
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Urbanica
Regarding the Queen City Hub Plan -
Has this idea been taken up seriously by any politician or policymaker? I have perused the plan and find it both fascinating and exciting if the various items are implemented, appropriate here to the reopening of Genesee Street, which could become Buffalo's new Main Street if properly done. Has there been anything in the news regarding the hub plan? Is there an elected official that is the champion of this plan?
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Sullymon54
this is from the BNE (buffalo niagara enterprise), they had someone in there graphics department come up with it a few years ago. it was to be used as a motivational tool, sort of a possible end state if everyone works towards it, It's mildly interesting/similar to this.
http://www.esnips.com/doc/d1da96ab-de24-493b-87c5-f05a713b129b/buffalo-potential-skyline
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mjman4
Density will not happen with 100s of acres of surface parking lots in our downtown core. Ther is no need currently to build above 4 stories...at all! so, while this is a nice exercise, mr issa should focus on getting those city owned parking areas out from under the thumb of paladino and other obstructionists developers and back on the tax rolls.
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RonR
Sally,
First off that investment is from 2003. Secondly it is partly funded by the ECIDA. Get back to me with the information of how the planned project went.
If you look hard enough and far enough back you can find where Bethlehem committed to investing in their Buffalo operations.
For example: In April of 2001 Bethlehem with GM they will both upgrade their plants. http://www.impomag.com/scripts/ShowPR~RID~2015.asp
In November of 2001 Bethlehem files for Chapter 11 http://www.impomag.com/scripts/ShowPR~RID~2015.asp
What you showed is a PRESS RELEASE. For $80 I could put a press release out that I intend to buy the Kansan City Royals and move them to Buffalo. It does not mean it will ever happen.
Just how many announcements have been made about things that never happen in Buffalo.
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sally
The General Mills project was completed in late 2006. There are currently 475 people employed there according to Business First book of lists.
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sally
Ron R:
If you look hard enough and long enough you will see that Bethlehem Steel's bankruptcy has zero impact on the modernization of a cereal factory. It was announce as a $23 million dollar 3 year modernization plan in 2003 and was completed as promised. You stated that General Mills would NEVER invest in Buffalo - you were proven wrong - case closed!
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happyone
Well, uh, yes, the view would be blocked to some as Dan said. Toronto seems to be doing just fine in spite of it. Some of these glorious architects have left buildings for us to appreciate that are rotting because no one wants to BE downtown. Maybe the architecture referred to would be cherished and restored if it became the cool place to do business. Overrun with vehicles because of growth? How bout using the rapid transit to bring people in and out? The inflated parking that would occur would encourage it's use The wheel has already been invented. Granted that our rail system needs to improve drastically to be functional. But, I am so very, very, very, very tired of the same people's constant objections to everything. Go form a know-it-all club and hang out with each other. These same people you see and HEAR at public meetings who don't do anything in life but criticize other peoples ideas. I grow weary of your voices and the same blah, blah blah.
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sally
Be gone with the C.A.V.E. men!!! Bring on prosperity.
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tommyBluez
In regards to Dan's comments.... that's the problem with Buffalo.
Everyone is stuck in the old ways. No one wants all new, no one wants all old, no one can agree on a compromise.
Yes, the visions of those great archtects and developers and planners should be respected; however, you have to remember, 100 years have passed and a LOT has changed. We also have to evolve to take that into consideration. I'm all for restoring beautiful old art deco, romanesque buildings, keeping the gorgeous victorians, italianates, and other varied gorgeous houses in buffalo.
But, there are times when buildings are disgustingly irreperable, sit in disrepair -- then someone comes along and watns to remove it and build something that will bing business - runs into so much negativity and regressive force against it.... they end up running them out.
I don't know, it seems no one in buffalo will ever reach a compromise between old and new.
*shrugs*
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Biniszkiewicz
I''m confused as to any value of this study. Sure, our downtown could look like that, if there was demand for it.
How does creation of such a model lead to development? Is it that suddenly our eyes are opened to see that sites are available upon which to build (as if we didn't realize those sites existed)? Pie in the sky musing about what we might look like with twice downtown's density will, imho, do nothing to attract the jobs which fund the development.
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mjs
Very well put flyguy, I agree, we need diversity. Cities are inherently chaange driven and diverse. I am thankful that we are now adding to our downtown architectural mix with some new modern architecture such as the Erie County crime lab, 285 delaware, and yes Blue cross. As for architecture I feel it is extremely important for cities to grow and change, they are dynamic places and as such should represent the many generations and eras of human kind including architecture. Whats wrong with having a downtown mixed with 19th, 20th, and 21st century examples of architectural style? Who are we to say what architectural style is best? I enjoy a diverse downtown, even that "ugly" city court building with the big slabs and no windows because it represents an era. Buildings like the ugly convention center are bad site decisions and I would say in those cases should be looked at for ..... And I am excited to think that a foreign developer has belief in our town that he will add to our skyline. My fingers are crossed that he can lease the space.
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tonyarmani
Lets start a "Bashar Issa Day" in Buffalo and celebrate it as a excuse not to work! It would almost be like St. Patrick's Day in the first ward, where everyone ages 5 and up gets drunk all day and has a good time. I'm sure its what he would have wanted.
PS - Not for nothing there should be tons of high rise apartment buildings all along the waterfront. We don't need more greenspace we need more people.
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Hospitable
Possible... maybe... essential not at all.
Bashar Issa empty your pockets and do the following if you want downtown to look like this:
1. Tear down the skyway 2. bury the 90 3. Run for county executive and draw a development line in the suburbs, turning development toward the core.
and for all you parking lot haters.. get over it.... we are drivers.. and the situation is only going to get worse with all the development going on downtown right now... theres more ppl and there are going to be morre cars...theres going to be more parking lots because WE HAVE NO TRAIN.....
Bashar please build a train as well.
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RonR
Sally.
If you are going to get picky, I stated that GM would never invest in Buffalo in 2007 and you showed investment in 2003 completed in 2006. So it is impossible for me to be proven wrong unless GM invests more after today.
My comments about Bethlehem is announcing investments or actually doing investments are no lock for a company staying.
I am not saying that General Mills is going to leave this month. I am saying that they will leave at some point.
The other point is even with the 475 jobs, the current location of the General Mills plant holds back development.
That is unless you think the future of Buffalo is going to be based on being a major port for grain and industry.
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vgs
I hope you are kidding RonR. If not I would avoid future debates if I were you.
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chris69
Oh my no wonder Buffalo has been stuggling, decaying, depopulating, deindustrializing for 75 years. I am constantly amazed at the level of baseless and un-insightful rhetoric that the average Buffalonian expresses....that better expresses the days of factories and beer taverns than high tech and entrepreneurial global business environment.
General Motors, Ford, Dupont, Dunlop, Moog, Fisher Price General Mills, HSBC, M&T, Citibank, etc....these are all good companies. To say that one company like General Mills isnt needed or is a detriment to our city is purely assinine!
General Mills is going to be joined by an Ethanol Plant and a Biodiesel Plant in the former silos! You know what, the outer harbor, inner harbor and cobblestone district will continue to develop with those industries there and will probably develop faster with those industries there than if they werent! My biggest regret is that Barilla Pasta didnt locate next to General Mills....and chose Rochester instead!
Now, I think any moron recognizes that the Ellicott Street grid needs to be re-opened but I do not think that the big push can come now! Once cars return to Main Street I think you will see a huge groundswell of complaints of people wanting one street after another re-opened.....the hyatt atrium and the convention center will be immediate casualties.
The second trend that is only partially represented in the above plan as one can see that expansion of the city to the north is limited while urban expansion to the east and to the south should have been accentuated. The area around the HSBC Tower and the Larkin District and the Cobblestone District is where I see the real future of the central business district.
Elmwood and Delaware and Main Street are going to be significantly limited by historical districts. Aside from a few parcels of high end infill....thats going to be pretty much it!
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RonR
Chirs69,
First off the companies you put up are all strong companies. I never said General Mills wasn't. But I am a realist and out of the 475 jobs, most are for unskilled/low skilled labor. Do I need to cover for everyone the likelihood of this type of work staying in Buffalo with the cost of doing business in WNY?
What is assinine is to think that General Mills is going to be there forever when the factors that forced so many great employers in the area to leave are STILL THERE.
The reason why I would like to see them go is IMO Buffalo needs to go in one direction with the outer harbor. Either industry or residential/commercial. You are not going to see both. With the current economic climate and the fact it is unlikely to change in the near future, I think Buffalo should make the decision and not have it made for them as it has countless times in the past.
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SteveP
So how many projects has Bashar Issa completed in the city of Buffalo?
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bradon
Be careful Steve, you shouldn't bash THE BASHAR!
I stated above that he has missed most milestones and deadlines on his projects in Manchester; he produces plans and ideas, flashy drawings and websites, and drives around in expensive cars tyring to prove something.
I am skeptical, he hasn't done much in Manchester, and he hasn't done much in Buffalo. Just enough to keep the press and desperate people of both cities happy.
I never questioned his intentions, just his execution; but that is enough to be branded a pessimist and Buffalo basher.
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platt4
This just in....Sarah Tower in Manchester is underway. SteveP and bradon, how can you explain THIS!?!?
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Andrew
Why does everyone have to hate this guy for spending his own money trying to bring our city back to life. This is just a concept sketch to show the potential for Buffalo to be developed. If more developers come to Buffalo then so will businesses and people and demand for more developments which means more opportunity and money for him. Great thinking and strategy on his part.
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Auburner
I did not read all of the posts but something was a bit alarming to me... Development for development sake equals vacancy. Buffalo needs to think about absorbtion rates; who will occupy all of these projects? Boston, for instance, will go through a very rapid decline in real estate demand because of all the overseas money going into developing that city, now they are even thinking of putting in a 120 story high sky scraper with vacancy rates running high in the city. New York can not find companies to fill the freedom tower so they rely on the state of NY to fill most of the floors. Yes it would be nice for Buffalo to have a signature skyline but sadly it would be only a movie set in the end, as it has no demand for the real estate...
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Auburner
“Some properties are more valuable than others. We wanted to come up with a series of building scenarios to enhance the existing skyline. If the City starts to sell off some of their properties at a reasonable rate, then it should be expected (from the purchaser) that a one-story building would not be built there. If the developer agrees to making a major investment in Buffalo, then there is no reason not to sell the land at a reasonable price. If the developer does not come through within a specified time frame then he or she forfeits the land and is penalized for wasting the City’s time. These contracts are not uncommon in prosperous cities.â€
SOUNDS TO ME LIKE THIS GUY IS LOOKING FOR A HANDOUT! ALA DONALD TRUMP IN MANHATTAN! Lure them in with big plans and settle for selfish small ones! Comedy... He is following the Trump rule from 30 years ago... Do not be fooled Buffalo, unless Buffalo is needing construction jobs, then it is Government subsidized development... May as well build Wilson another stadium....
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Auburner
And of course this guy is looking for distressed Government properties. Interest rates are still low and the Euro is at an all time high. This Con is looking to plunge on a city like Buffalo to extract as much as he can from the coffers of hard working people like you. He has no interest in being the citizen of the year, trust your instinct. This is a shell game... see through it...
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chris69
Oh my god Auburner give your paranoid pessimism a rest already.
Issa Basshar hasnt asked for a taxpayer handout yet. Not with the Statler and not with the City Tower and not with the Statler on the Sea and not with his visit to the Central Terminal.....so give it a friggin rest!
Second, considering the mentallity of suck the money, decay, abandon, demolish and replace with parking lot...until the city finances a new building.....Id say...once the Statler is complete if Issa wants a taxpayer financed development....then he as earned the cooperation and goodwill and trust of Buffalo and WNY.
Third, but until he asks for taxpayer money....shut the f-up with your speculation.
Fourth, STATISTICS AND STUDIES HAVE PROVEN THAT THE WHILE BUFFALO HAS A SURPLUS OF CLASS B AND CLASS C OFFICE AND RESIDENTIAL SPACE....WE HAVE A SHORTAGE OF CLASS A RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL SPACE.
FURTHERMORE THE REPORT WENT ON TO SAY THAT BUFFALO AND WESTERN NY COULD EFFECTIVELY DOUBLE ITS GROWTH RATE IF IT HAD MOVE IN READY CLASS A RESIDENTIAL, COMMERCIAL (OFFICE) AND INDUSTRIAL SPACE.
SO YOU CAN STICK YOUR PESSIMISM UP YOUR ARSE! IF ITS BUILT....THERE WILL BE PEOPLE AND BUSINESSES TO FILL IT!
ANY DOUBTS....THE LARKIN AT EXCHANGE PROVED....LARGE CLASS A PROJECTS....WILL SELL AND SELL PROFITABLY!
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SteveP
All I'm saying is that before we anoint this guy a saint and the savior of buffalo why don't we wait to see the speed and quality of his first project. The reviews that I've read from a quick Google search don't seem so promising.
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hrbuffinstuff
"Ultimately it will be the people returning to Buffalo that will be our biggest asset."
Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.
Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Ultimately it will be *attracting new people, new visions and new energy* to Buffalo that will be our biggest asset.
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Spaulding97
hmm, so far Issa has used $4.5 million of his own money to purchase the Statler, then he signs a contract worth $1.3 million to replaces the elevators. He is in town every other week either buying yachts for the hotel, eyeing new development (central terminal), and marketing our region better than our visitor/convention bureau. Show me ANY developer or person that has put more time and effort into our city. What's even more impressive, is he lives across the ocean and he is still doing more than anyone else in Buffalo. Yet, there are still buttheads bitching about lack of promise and development saying "he hasn't done anything". Really? c'mon that's ignorant.
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SteveP
Spaulding97,
So many ideas and plans have come and gone in the past 15 years that I'd like to see some results before I call this guy the savior of Buffalo. While everyone here is ready to get on their knees for this guy, I want to wait for the Statler Tower renovations to be finished within the stated time frame. Is that not reasonable? What's ignorant is somebody who just assumes that because he bought the building and has a yacht and drives in fancy cars that he must be up to something good here. Remember all those promises about the Adelphia Tower? Yeah that didn't work.
Do a quick google search on this guy and its apparent that he hasn't always been the best at keeping a reasonable time line on construction. The Sarah Tower was proposed in 2000, starting building in 2005 and then BSC fucked up construction by trying to build near a canal. In 2008 it might be open. I'm not saying I don't think the guy is for real and I'm not saying he isn't good for Buffalo. Let's just all take a step back and realize that this one man isn't the cure all for what ails Buffalo. Instead of jumping blindly on the bandwagon take a step back, let's look at the results of the Statler renovation when and if its completed and then if all is successful you can throw him a parade.
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skarnath
Mr. Issa surely deserves the benefit of everone's optimism, but i believe both First Amherst Development (Elk St. Terminal & Granite Works) & Rocco Termini (Ellicott Lofts, Is Lofts, Washington Market, Oak St. School, Webb Bldg.) deserve much of the credit for leading the current downtown renaissance. Honorable mention to Paul Iskalo for Electric Tower & his proposed plans for surrounding buildings. Rocco's next major downtown initiative should be announced soon.
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Spaulding97
The difference between all the empty promises and no action developments was action or lack there of. The Adelphia tower can't be compared to any Issa project. Adelphia never put any cash down for one.They didn't have any! It would be a different story if they bought the property, started the foundation and stopped. That's where Issa is now basically.
Don't get me wrong, I'm still nervous about his projects. I have to be, we're all used to it. But never has a developer done this. There's nothing to compare him with. So all we can do is wait and hope... as usual.
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doc
Nice renderings of what Buffalo may look like in another decade. The buildings are great but people are the main ingredient and I know numerous people who have left Buffalo and now want to return (with their families, partners, etc.) because they are beginning to experience the sense of excitement and promise that Mr. Issa and others are offering our charming and sophisticated urban center. A good friend is returning to Buffalo soon with his Florida-born fiancee who absolutely loves this city. Buffalo needs to be more Smug in it's attitude, perhaps even a little arrogance might do well. We tout our architectural heritage, great weather, international flavor, border town status, cultural assets, etc. but we somehow lack the smug factor. I am very smug about our town and I do not take seriously other's whose attitudes are not. The value, worth, vitality, savvy, and promise of Buffalo can no longer be ignored. It seems that others see this about our great city much sooner than we do. Hopefully that will change. P.S. Removing the I-190 will not necessarily guarantee open access to the waterfront. If you need an example of this look at the catastrophe in the much touted city of Toronto.
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flyguy
I recognize that not everyone is college material and not everyone has aspirations to sit in an office. There is alot of value in working with your hands and working hard physically. I am disturbed at those who balk at an employer because the jobs they offer are "unskilled". So what if they are unskilled? Thats one of the problems with this economy is that it has been pushed so far one way that many many people have been left out and now scramble to find employment and now we have working class neighborhoods turned poor ghettos. I think its time tro have some more respect for both "skilled" and "unskilled" labor because not everyone has the interests, the money, the uprbinging, the social network, etc. to go get a graduate degree and sit in an office somewhere. People need to be respected as long as they arent going out of the way to use the system and negatively contribute to the population. I dont view unskilled work any less than I view someone working a corpoarte office. We all need jobs, we all need to contribute and pitch in to make civilization work, everyone has their role. Some people manage, others think, some pump gas, others clean sinks.
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RonR
Flyguy,
There is no shame in working with your hands or working hard. My point on unskilled labor and as it relates to WNY is the lifestyle that these folks want to live. I am sorry but someone who has nothing more then a HS degree and works in a plant doing a job that requires little to no analytical skill should not live an upper middle class lifestyle. I am sorry but going straight out of HS to a union plant should not equate to $25-30 an hour plus overtime and mega benefits. Unfortunately, this is the reality of WNY and the reason why so many companies are leaving.
Skilled labor on the other hand, as in a master electrician, woodworker, mason or field engineer takes an investment of time and additional work to achieve. This needs to be rewarded. This does not mean that they should make $45-$50 an hour. They should be making $30 an hour and have unskilled labor moved closer to $15.
You inability to view an unskilled worker in a different light then someone in a corporate job is the challenge. Right off the bat, I see in almost all cases more education, longer hours, more risk of not working under a union contract and a much more competitive field. These differences need to be rewarded and celebrated IMO.
Yes we all need jobs but all jobs should not and can not provide middle class life with a nice home, two newer cars, a vacation every year and a healthy savings. The reason why Buffalo feel behind is for a couple of generations that ambition was lost amongst a large section of the youth to do more then just head into the factory or plant. Anyone with reasonable intelligence knew of the pending challenges facing the auto industry going back to 1970 but yet we have thousands of workers today with 5 to 25 years in this industry claiming to be blindsided by the turn of events in the last decade.
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bghahn
are there any other associated drawings available? perhaps from a different direction? I could look at this for hours...
did anyone else notice the new development around the central terminal? possibly platforms for a new commuter rail system. one can only dream...
GO BASHAR!!! I believe!
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rickyrick
If Buffalo looked like this, it most likely wouldn't be so EMPTY all the time, retail would be visible with all the workers and residence's filling these buildings and people may actually move to the area.
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flyguy
I agree that maybe it shouldnt equal 30-40 bucks plus mega benefits to work in "unskilled" labor but you know a living wage with some benefits is deserved by all. I am not a big fan of pushy whiny unions that go out of their way to tie up a non union construction project, i find it immature and babyish. But, why do we have people in unskilled labor working two jobs 50-70 hours a week in this country? Why are people getting paid just 9 bucks an hour after 9 years of employment in a place? This pro globalization rant that some people are on are creating world class rich men and bringing everyone else down. I'm sorry but if you work 40 hours a week I dont give a rats you know what if you go around picking up trash off the curb you should be able to afford a home or rent and a small family and put some food on the table. This work til you drop culture is BS and leaves many important priorities in life out. Its alot easier to work overtime and more worth it if you are making 100K than if you pull 10 or 12K a year and yes many many people are only pulling 10-20K a year. Not everyone can live in fantasy land out in East Amherst and Clarence and believe me I know what its like out there because I worked landscaping for 9 years through high school and college. In many cases they are extremely specialized in one area and great at what they do but when it comes to some of the most basic common se4nse things its like a light was turned out and things got cloudy. Yes I had higher aspirations and have moved up economically but it makes me no better than theguys down in the trenches busting A$$ for 8 bucks an hour. Take 8 bucks an hour in a small company and subtract medical insurance and taxes and see what you have left to live on that week? I'm not saying the responsibility is directly on the company itself either but i am recognizing the fact that we live in a society that puts all its interests in a few baskets and lets everyone else hang. We give multi million dollar contracts to play games? To entertain us? Yeah they work hard and yeah they are elite and yes they should be compensated but 30-100 million over a few years? C'mon? We have CEO's in this country with multi billion dollar estates? How many people did they walk on to get to that point? Yes at the top of a company you should be loaded however you shouldnt be that loaded if you have working poor working for you. On another note I would love to see some of these elitely educated people with the "skilled" jobs do some "unskilled" work and see how they fare? The same can be said the other way around as well but the point is that we have many people screwed by being "unskilled" and we need these people as much as we need the "skilled".
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nick
flyguy its simple supply and demand, there is a large pool of unskilled labor so they will work for low wages otherwise someone else will take the job. Sports stars get paid millions of dollars because we demand to see them, and their supply is limited. Until the country decides to adopt socialism there will always be those that are high paid and those low paid. While I agree that everyone deserves a living wage, it isn't a right to earn a high wage if you don't have skills that are in demand.
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RoBearSucks
It truly makes me angry and sad that so many of you are against this kind of development. For once in a very very long time some one wants to help and has a vision that is good for all of us. Maybe it is only a vision but how will we know if we continue to to be skeptical of everything and everyone. And yes, it is for his benefit financially, but it can only be that way if we benefit too. It has to be win-win if he expects to make money. Maybe you should ask yourselves what you have done for this city and area? It seems like you want it to fail and if that is the case then go somewhere else because im tired of hearing this defeatist bullshit.
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RonR
Flyguy,
You math is a little off. Someone working a minimum wage @ 40 hours a week makes $15,080 a year. So it is impossible to make 10k a year. Secondly, someone working minimum wage and working just 5 hours of OT a week or 1 extra hour a day will make $17,761.25. Not great but neither is the skill needed to get a job like this.
Move ahead to someone making $9.00 an hour @ 40 hours a week. That is $18,720 a year and still not much skill needed. Now add 5 hours a week of OT and that works out to $22,230. This is more then enough for a single person to live on in Buffalo. Heck, I know people who own a home in South Buffalo, have two cars, one person working and one staying at home with a child on this wage. IT IS CALLED A BUDGET.
The challenge with your concept is you took an $8 an hour job is that salary to the worker is about 70% of the cost to the employer. The other 30% goes to benefits both mandated by the government and supplied by the employer. So even a minimum wage employee cost about $10 an hour to staff.
Now to make an example, lets take a local hardware store. To compete with Home Depot, they need to keep the same hours, which is 108 a week. To staff the place, they need at least 2 people on the floor at all times. So this is 208 hours a week. To staff this, they will need people. 5 full time at 40 hours with 8 hours of OT each week. Now paying $7.15 an hour costs $10.00. $10.00 an hour at 200 hours with 8 hours of OT at $13.95 equals a cost to the employer of $2111.95 per week to run the store. Keep the store open for 52 weeks and you have $109,772 a year in employee costs.
Now move the wage from $7.15 to $10.00 an hour and your hourly cost goes to $13.00 and your OT cost goes to $19.50. So take 200 hours a week at $13 and 8 hours a week at $19.50 and your weekly employee cost goes to $2756 a week and $143,312 a year.
Now that is a $33,540 increase in cost to the employer or an extra $91.00 a day. Now $91.00 a day may seem small but when your margins are under 5% profit as they are in a lot of cases, that almost $2000 more in sales needed a day, EVERY DAY OF THE YEAR.
My point in all of this is its not as simple as saying give someone $3 an hour in New York state. The cost of an employee needs to shrink from 30% to 15% as it is in other places in the country.
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SLEEPL8
I love the "bury the 190 and skyway" demands. Do you dipshits know how much that would cost and how much more/better development could be done with that amount of money? You could build multiple towers and anew football stadium for what it would cost to tunnel those highways. I guarantee that in 50 years people would bitch about how stupid it was to put our roadways underground...just like we complain about the train on main st. I am glad you tunnel digging morons arent in charge.
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rickyrick
The city is too poor to grow. You'll have to get NEW People in Office, OUTSIDE BLOOD from MAJOR CITIES who KNOW HOW TO GET THESE kinds of developments to happen. If you depend on the current office...don't hold your breath.
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