Why not let M&T continue to use this as a parking lot during the week, and hold a flea market/farmer's market there on the weekends? This would obviously not work so well in the winter, but it would be a low cost way to get something happening on this site for at least part of the year.

No No No, I think this is a good money maker for the city to bring back.

The problem is that downtown Buffalo doesnt have the residential population that could patronize a public market but that might change as we rebuild and redevelop.

Believe me there are plenty of local farmers willing to sell fruit and veggies

Believe me there are still butchers and hunters to sell everything from Buffalo, Ostrich, Deer, Moose, Elk...and all sorts of specialty meets.

Look at all the people that drive to clarence for their antiques market.

(Frankly I always thought the Memorial Aud would make a better small boutique mall with the floor making a great public market surrounded by one, two or three floors fair sized boutiques. Its on light rail and its not as huge as main place which means that it would be viable with much less)

But again, theres nothing wrong with a public (especially since theres no walmart, wegmans or tops downtown or in the city ) market but we need more people living downtown. Once we get more people downtown, a public market in Buffalo could be as successful as in any other city. Perhaps even better because the people of Buffalo are filled with heart and soul and we love our neighbors and our city.

Wow, you've certainly gotten an earfull from the community on this one. My opinion--a huge, permanent market would be fantastic. I'm envisioning a Toronto-style St. Lawrence Fish Market or a bigger, better Broadway Market. It should have tons of variety and not just food--soaps, flowers, cooking utensils, clothing, candles, etc. We could call it the Buffalo Bazaar Marketplace or something. I agree with Lou (from the comments) that if given the opportunity, the public would really support this. There's nothing downtown in terms of a large food market or other retail for that matter. I live in the 'burbs and I would definately come shop there, and not just once a month, more like one a week! I think Buffalo is really starved for variety and now with all these residential buildings coming up, what better way to tie into a wholistic, urban community than this. We have our share of restaurants and boutiques (love Elmwood/Hertal!) and now we need to open up to other concepts. I love this idea and if anyone is willing to form some sort of committee to study this or get the ball rolling, count me in.

Here's another description of the Chippewa Market on a Saturday night, written in The Express in December, 1900.

"You must go on Saturday evenings at 10pm when everything is in full swing, including the light and somke from the torches flaring out into the darkness and the odor of sauerkraut and cheese float on the evening breeze. Saturday is the vendors festival nigt and whole families come and see the fun."

A few quick thoughts-

1. Urban Renewal decimated much of the fabric and density of our inner city.

2. Downtown's central role as a shopping and gathering place has certainly changed over the years.

3. Its better to build an economy by nuturing small businesses and entrepreneurs than silver bullets.

4. M&T Bank needs to sell this lot for a more productive use.

I live a stones throw from the 'shovel-ready' site you refer to and often wish it was something other than parking lot (which sits almost empty on the week-ends.) How about turning it into an urban park with trees, a small bandshell, etc? It could even have a small scale market such as you describe. Would it be more likely to happen if it were named "Wilmers Park"?

I live near Hertel, which has plenty of antique/consignment stores, but they have little turnover. I would love a reason not to drive out to Clarence. Kelly's (Anticue Market) has quite an empire out there: the flee market on the weekend, the permanent vendors; events in the larger shelter. Red Balloons, an antique linens shop once in the City, moved out to Main a few years ago for safety and to be near other similar retailers. I bet they would return if there was a safe well planned destination to come home to.

Tim Tielman has come up with some good ideas about how to use this vast lot during down times by building a variety of different kinds of temporary structures that could house and host a variety of different kinds of uses inlcuding stages for performances and shelters for temporary markets.. Project for Public Spaces, a wonderful organization in NYC that specializes in "placemaking", deals with these kinds of issues all of the time and would have some excellent ideas about how to enliven and enhance this critcally located, yet dead, space.

yes I do remember the market - it was wonderful!

nothing will happen to improve our town unless WE make it happen. we can not count on m&t or any one individual. but together WE can do what ever is needed to rebuild this city. WE can not wait for our city fathers to lead us. WE must formulate our ideas, put a plan together and DEMAND that the government entities (that exist) help US put our wishes into action. there is has been close to $20 million/year coming to our city for community development projects - it has been 'miss-spent' for decades. if a committee/profit/not-for-profit group is formed - please count me in.

Does anyone have any links to pictures of what this market used to look like? The description is amazing, and I would love to see some photos of this time period as well.

The Chelsea Flea in New York rules. This could be done downtown. Laura, if you're listening, this could be the chance you have been waiting for. If not on this location, then there must be something near it. And a small park could not hurt. You need some grass to sit down on when the bands are playing.

WNY Heritage Press has a photo here:

http://wnyheritagepress.org/photosofweek/washst_market.htm

I think a public market - food, antiques, clothes, flowers, is a winner for any city that undertakes it. Not sure what we'd be in for weather wise, but I think we're creative enough for that.

London not only has the Portobello Road Market, but the Camden Market, and about a doezn others on the weekend.

Surely WNY bargain hunters could support a market in the city.

No parks! No no no no no! We already have downtown parks: Lafayette Square, Cathedral Park, Niagara Square, the marina, the pocket park between the Division Streets, and the forthcoming landscaping around the Michigan St. Baptist Church. No one goes downtown to hang out in a park unless it is Thursday in the Square. We need places that concentrate activity, not disperse it.

What we don't have enough of downtown is downtown! Mixed use buildings like markets, theaters, apartments, shops, offices, churches, schools, and restaurants! If you can't figure out what should go on that site, assuming anyone could pry it out of M&T's death grip, look around it. You see (mostly) unbroken collections of 2-4 story brick commercial buildings, built right up to the sidewalk, with storefronts below and offices (or other uses) above.

If we cannot have a market, which would be my first choice, then let's aim for more of the good urbanism that still remains downtown.

Want a park? Walk to The Square at midnight on a friday or Monday and Good Luck!!! No more parks. WE NEED BUSINESS, ACTIVITY, PEOPLE FORGET THE PARKS WE HAVE MORE PARKS THAN PARKING RAMPS!!!!

How about encouraging Buffalo Place to run a Saturday antiques/flea market on this site? Why should the only events of this type locally be located in the 'burbs? I visited London last summer and was amazed by the people, activity and energy at the Portobello Road Market. Thousands of people descend on that neighborhood every Saturday in search of bargains or simply to people watch. If M&T needs the lot for parking Monday through Friday, maybe they can make it available on Saturdays and make a contribution to renewed weekend vitality downtown. The Clarence Antique Market and GEX Flea Market in Cheektowaga have demonstrated for many years that there is demand for this kind of experience; unfortunately, neither one is particularly convenient for city residents.

mark, what about the third room being one of the biggest coke bars in the city !

Great idea ebflo! M&T sold off the lot behind Sheas- I'm sure they'd dispose of this lot if the city build them a parking ramp (ughhh).

But I do think there is a need for a small park at this edge of downtown- definitely not on this parcel though. The parks Cynthia mentions aren't located where the new downtown residences are, are poorly located, and aren't true parks with grass, trees, maybe a small tot lot, dog run, etc. I have a perfect location: the post office site on Washington. Get rid of that cinder block bunker and have the post office lease space in the 700 Block of Main- parking right on the street.

Visit Millinium Park in Chicago and start to imagine that sceen in Buffalo. Live music, arts, dining, retail, open grass, benches and water fountains. Green space enhances residential development. This block could be a true public square, already flanked by retail, residential and offices. I respectfully disagree Cynthia, there can never be enough urban parkland. Just take a look at those parks on any decent day in the city.