This sounds like an amazing concept and luv the sketch work.
Please Buffalo, let's not turn this into another Peace Bridge. Can we afford to wait 10 years while everyone with an idea gets a chance to submit it?
I dont care a bit about the building or the sports history that happened there. Significant sports history happened in many different venues and the buildings are taken down when they dont serve a useful purpose as they have been replaced. I look at Shea Stadium as a perfect example of this. However, this concept of having an elevated store with a tremendous view of the waterfront and downtown does sound intriguing and you have to put parking somewhere anywhere so why not within the same structure where it can be sheltered. Sounds like a good concept. If this delays progress down there anymore though I say tear it down and keep things moving. Everytime we second guess and third and fourth guess we end up delaying forward momentum by years and years. I would like to see a reborn waterfront and downtown sometime in my lifetime. I liked the idea of potentially extending the Commercial slip further inland and I wonder what the impact of keeping this building would be on that?
too little too late. We have a really good plan that extends the canals and creates more waterfront properties in downtown than anyone imagined. This while a great idea should have been thrown out there about 2 years ago.
The Aud had some memorable sports events - but it's time to reuse the land for 21st Century Buffalo. In other new --- Buffalo News Article on The Washington Market
I think this is a pretty creative idea...the Canal side project is going to require some close, indoor parking to the site, why not? The Aud is still standing, and it's probably Bass Pro's call on what the building looks like, so I doubt it's too late - or would delay the project. It would certainly be a memorable building, if ever built.
Though I'm sympathetic to keeping the original war memorial building intact, I think that the Bass Pro shop needs to be at the ground level. Haven't there been talks of extending a watered canal right up to the shop so that anglers can pull right up? Also, when they were planning to build the complex underneath the Skyway, there was a large patio on the water for dining and recreation. I have a feeling that this plan would strand the store high up in the air, away from the water that both citizens and Bass Pro want to augment.
I respect any well intended, thought out plan. However, the current plan actually works pretty well. For a change, we are looking at a proposal that is not broken from the start. Let's stick with it.
OMG! NO! Please let's move forward. No more conceptual designs, please (especially ones that still show the skyway-YUK.)! Knock down the old Aud and build a new building as planned. No more delays!
Honestly, the last thing downtown Buffalo needs is more parking space.
Let the plan continue to move along. I will miss the Old Aud, but will cheer the progress the City makes in removing it.
Very creative idea. Too bad he wasn't involved in the planning phases of the project. Maybe someone will think to include him in future projects - a little vision and creativity goes a long way, but it needs to come early on in the project or things will never happen.
Who gets the salvage rights to the Aud? I've heard the steel alone is worth in the millions.
I believe Bass Pro already did quite the comprehensive study several years ago when looking at a number of different options for the Aud and decided it wasn't an option.
SAL - the scrap salvage value is usually built into the demo bid to reduce the overall out of pocket cost of the demo. Either way, I don't believe the actual demolition has been bid as of yet, as the current contract simply involves removal of hazardous materials to get ready for demo.
Hmm, let's see: Parking on the bottom - store on top. Sounds like the Rainbow Centre. It's time to let go of the Aud and move on.
If you have a retail store on the top floor, you'd have to have the parking garage be tall enough for delivery trucks to go all the way to the top for unloading. I suppose you could use freight elevators but I think it'd just become a nightmare to stock the store. Let's stick with what is planned, there is no point throwing in more ideas at this stage unless you want the project stalled.
Lets let everyone in Buffalo submit their own idea of what should be done with the aud. Let's make the deadline January 1, 2009. After that lets take the next two years to review all the proposals. Then, lets pick 5 ideas that we can all fight over for say....3 more years. Then once we pick one someone needs to bring the idea to court and we can tie it up there for 2 more years. Then lets scrap the idea all together and start the process over in 2014. That way we can keep being Buffalo....the city where nothing ever gets done because the decision making parties are completey corrupt/incompetent. It's a nice idea but lets keep at that.
Wrong. It is too late.
No more drawings. Go with the current plan. Its hard to sell kayaks when you are four stories above the water. Just start construction.
Are there litter and debris measures in place to ensure the commercial slip is kept clean of floating debris, etc. that collect in nooks and crannies? Having visited the Baltimore Inner Harbor now on a number of occassions I noticed they basically have water surface vacuums that collect and remove litter. Though I think littering is shameful it always seems to show up and wind blows stuff around as well. If this commercial slip were extended even further I think for sure some measure needs to be in place. Anyone know of any details on this?
this is a BAD idea. Is any hack with colored pencils allowed to express THEIR opinion on multimillion dollar developments? If so i have some ideas for the martin house....it is tooo....oh i don;t know...too franklloydwright-y why don't we clad it in vinyl ! let me get some renderings together!!!! perfect! my opionion and my taste count for something....
pffffff....please.
“Haven't there been talks of extending a watered canal right up to the shop so that anglers can pull right up?”
They still can, they aren’t coming up to Bass Pro as a drive through, they get out of the boat and take the 4 story glass enclosed escalator up to the store.
“too disengaged from the street.”
What’s better a Skylon view of the water or a view of Washington Street and concrete?
“Seriously Its too late. Knock this pile down already”
Why it isn’t like it has been started – some plans would need to be changed, let do the right thing from the start for a change.
Next thing you know you will want to build a “Signature Bridge”, which as long as I have your attention for a moment is the largest waste of time, effort and money ever in this community. A recent article noted that there were something like 20 signature bridges in the country. Go ahead name them (without Google), how many have you visited……….. (take out the Golden Gate) after all did you go to S.F. to see the bridge or did you see the bridge because you were in S.F.
Things are moving forward at the freezer queen site. http://www.buffalonews.com/149/story/344580.html
If they can knock down Yankee Stadium they can knock down this hunk of junk.
I went to San Fran to see the Golden Gate Bridge. I went to Tampa St. Pete to see the Sunshine Skyway, and I went to Charleston to see the Arthur Ravenel Jr. Bridge, and although maybe not signature, I go to Pittsburgh to see their lovely bridges. I did not google.
It is too late, the plans seem set in stone but it does bring a tear to my eye to think that a limestone clad art deco building will be replaced with a value engineered aluminum building. These materials just aren't used anymore, and beneath the 1970s cladding is a beautiful etiface.
Brenwils25 - I think the point that I am trying to make on this off topic post is that recovering the costs of building this bridge will never happen because of increased tourism.
Even if they charge what SF charges which is increasing to 6 bucks each way soon. Some of the proponents of the bridge talk about better service and faster crossings that will eliminate traffic issues, spend a fraction of the cost on people to staff booths and customs and not only does it alleviates congestion it puts people to work and more money in the local economy. I realize that construction workers need work as well but not on this.
The CooperRiver Ravenel bridge is a beautiful bridge, I just question the economics and reasoning behind ours.
How come people in this city get worked up over building coming down but not this one? We have seizures over a crumbling old bar coming down but not the Aud and its storied past. Why is that the case? Where does the PB stand on this issue? (no sarcasm, I'm really asking.)
Jeffshome - in an urban development such as this its more important to care for the character of the street which for Canalside is best characterized by retail on the sidewalk that will help create a cohesive shopping district rather then detached retail spaces that give no life to the street. It's too insular.
Please, Please Please can we just move forward with the plan we already have. We could literally argue for decades to come over the different designs which are feasible, but that won't help Buffalo one bit...
It is never too late to bring solutions to the table. However, this is an idea and not a solution.
Judging by the drawing, this was not an idea that came to Larry last night with too much coffee in his system. It appears that he put a considerable amount of time into this. My question is why did he "go the the press" without the full story?
For this idea to be considered a solution, multiple variables would have to be considered. The main one is financing. Rather surprised that a "money guy" left this out of his idea. The second, is Bass Pro. While debates have been had about Bass Pro, one has to admit that it is amazing they stuck around this long. If that is a good or bad sign is yet to be determined. The list goes on and on for other items to be considered.
So while this idea has some good in it, it is not a solution. Maybe this is the trademark of Buffalo. A city of a 1,000 ideas, little solutions and almost zero action.
I think this idea to save the Aud is just pathetic.
Extending the Commercial Slip all the way in to the site of the historic Spaulding Mercantile (where Bass Pro will now occupy) and then rewatering a small "T" which consists of the original Erie Canal and the original Main/Hamburg Canal is brilliant and will do much more than a stupid parking ramp.
Pathetic.....Pathetic.....Pathetic....
Furthermore, a small section of rewatered Main/Hamburg Canal would be a perfect segue to rewatering the Ohio Basin/Canal for a new Convention/Conference Center signaling what would be the southern most end of the South Buffalo Erie Canal warehouse district and wharf.
Its a wonderful master plan....its hard to call anyone who wants to trade it in for a parking garage anything more than pathetic.
How come the Senecas can execute projects in light speed? Take a drive by the Casino site and see how quickly they can design, mobilize & begin construction on a project.
I'm not saying that I'm completely unhappy with the progress that has been made on the inner harbor, but this is a fraction of what was proposed 3 or 4 years ago. Is the remainder now going to sit idle until the Donovan Bldg and the Aud come down?
One other note...
Too late with the alternative plans. Bulldoze the Aud and move forward before Tielman decides he likes this plan and brings the demolition to a screeching halt!
The bass pro project has been a catalyst for suggesting new ideas to turn our inner harbor around. What i like about this plan is how it opens up the space. The design kind of reminds me of a combination of old and new, all very similar to the albright knox. It creates a reason for bass pro to be an important part of buffalo's history. Yet i would rather develop a relationship based strictly on visual impact and speculative popularity. The whole idea that bass pro must be at the aud site is about as comforting as a dallas cowboy cheerleader.
Taking a page from Monet’s Boulevard des Capucines. I feel like our best option is building bass pro into Main Street and the canal space on the donovan lot. We know what we have with the boring facade of the buffalo news, build some old time roof lighting for this location and let the building that wants to be a ship, sell outdoor supplies. Not only will building on this site save money, it would speed up the process and allow for a greater visual impact. Stretching out along mainstreet towards the inner harbor, bass pro could build a combination of both designs and draw even more attention by becoming the initial identifier for a truly grand plan. The key here is allowing enough space for a whole history of development projects.
They can demolish the Donovan and start construction well before the aud has things figured out. Someone should be down there with spray paint drawing the lines of where the canal would be.
Just let the wreckers do their job and try to forget The Aud, because it's replacement by something truly forgettable is well nigh and irrevocable. Hope that Bass Pro is as successful here as at Foxboro MA and look to the next preventable atrocity. All That Greed And Politics Can Do is running the show now: sit back and enjoy the spectacle.
WHO CARES ABOUT THE AUD? KNOCK THE DAMN THING DOWN AND LETS ROLL ON THE PLANS WE HAVE.
I wish some of these people would get a life and drop these foolhardy ideas of saving the old Aud. It is getting demolished and that is final. Get over it and move on with life. The old Aud is not worth saving, it is basically just a plain jane concrete and limestone clad box with a metal roof. The building has deteriorated considerably since the Sabres vacated it for HSBC Arena in the 1990s. Instead of wasting creativity and time on saving the deteriorated Memorial Auditorium, why doesn't this man with this latest proposal instead come up with new designs for the proposed development on this prime site.
Problem with this city is everyone tries to preserve everything. It is time to let go of the Aud and move on. knock it down.
Buidling more canals throughout would be amazing for that district.
Let's clear up some things about the aud. There is no "amazing edifice" behind the metal covering, those are 1970's additions which removed the previous facade and added staircases, elevators, then-modern locker rooms, and many more food venues. Remove the metal, find many holes in walls. As for the aud deteriorating, its not collapsing, all it really needs is a new roof and all new mechanicals and alot of cosmetic stuff, not bad for a building that old.
This idea is nice, but lets keep rolling.
Gaustad
Hahahaha That is funny "everyone tries to save everything" So funny I am crying. Have you looked around town?
AUD = Daisey cutter: result shovel ready. timeframe 1 day.....lets get moving.......no more ideas!
AUD = Daisey cutter: result shovel ready. timeframe 1 day.....lets get moving.......no more ideas!
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