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Powerhouse Not Being Demolished; Not Yet Anyway

UPDATED UPDATE:  Peter Krog tells The Buffalo News he will preserve the building “if” he can, says there are structural issues with the building, and if he does demolish it he’ll put a parking lot in its place.  Oh, and he was slapped with a Stop Work order from the City.

He said he was not “currently” considering demolition but raised the prospect of putting in a parking lot if he deemed the building beyond repair.

“We have not determined what we are going to do with that building. We have a parking problem there, and there are structural issues with that building we are evaluating,” he said.

Krog, who is an engineer, said there was also a “huge foundation failure” in the rear of the building.

“I am for preserving anything I can. We’re preserving the Trico building, and if I can preserve it, I will preserve it. If I can’t, I won’t,” Krog said.

__________________________________________

UPDATE:  Presevation Buffalo Niagara spoke with ower Jim Cornell who said the Powerhouse is not being demolished.  From PBN’s Facebook page:

“he assured us that the bricks were removed for a structural analysis of the building as part of the plan to rehabilitate the building. There is NO intention to demolish the Powerhouse.  Excecutive Director Tom Yots and I went to the site today and the bricks are neatly stacked on a pallet and have been carefully removed.”

__________________________________________

Perhaps the Larkin Powerhouse at Seneca and Larkin streets is not going residential afterall.  It’s feared the building could be going to landfill instead.

Members of the Campaign for Greater Buffalo History, Architecture & Culture have witnessed and documented illegal demolition activity at the R.J. Reidpath-designed powerhouse. A section of brick wall is being removed by contractors working on behalf of the building’s owner, developer Seneca Holdings LLC consisting of Peter Krog’s Krog Corporation, Jim Cornell of Praxiis LLC, and Gordon Reger’s Reger Holdings LLC.  The trio are redeveloping the adjacent 701 Seneca Street into Larkin Center of Commerce.

larkinloftsb

In 2011, Seneca Holdings proposed converting the building into “Larkin Lofts” containing fifty-four residences ranging from 600 to 1,300 square feet.  There was to be enclosed parking for 54 vehicles, plus storage for individual tenants, and a 37-car parking lot to the west of the building.

Contractors said the building would be demolished “in a month.” Piles of bricks and a wrapped pallet of bricks were photographed by The Campaign.  A query at the Department of Inspections revealed no permit for the demolition work, nor applications filed for the building as a whole.  The Buffalo Preservation Board, which must review all demolition applications, has also not received any notice of such an application.

Campaign Executive Director Tim Tielman expects to give the City of Buffalo Preservation Board a nomination form to designate the powerhouse and all the Larkin Company buildings as a local historic district.  Once accepted, the Board could vote as early as today to schedule a public hearing.

“It is unfortunate and outrageous that a building owner seeking to exploit the historic cachet of the Larkin Company would destroy part of the nation’s legacy for a parking lot,” Tielman said.  “A Larkin Historic District would give long overdue formal recognition and protection to one of America’s most important industrial complexes. It would also offer the maximum protection for the endangered powerhouse.”

Krog’s company is enjoying the fruits of other public and private investments in “Larkinville.”  M&T Bank recently leased a large block of space, and Krog has been building and repaving parking lots in the area.

“There is always a creative solution to parking issues that is short of demolition, and if Krog can’t develop the building, I am sure there are other developers out there who would be happy to do so,” says Tielman.  “We are determined to fight very hard to save the powerhouse, and I am sure the public will agree we cannot lose this building.”

Frank Lloyd Wright’s Larkin Administration Building, across the street from the powerhouse, was demolished in 1950.  Seneca Holdings currently owns the site and operates it as a parking lot.

Buffalo Department of Permits and Inspection Services Commissioner James Comerford, reached by The Campaign on Wednesday afternoon, vowed to send an inspector to the site as soon as possible.

Loft or Parking Lot? Seneca Holdings, 716.856.0810

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Written by Buffalo Rising

Buffalo Rising

Sometimes the authors at Buffalo Rising work on collaborative efforts in order to cover various events and stories. These posts can not be attributed to one single author, as it is a combined effort. Often times a formation of a post gets started by one writer and passed along to one or more writers before completion. At times there are author attributions at the end of one of these posts. Other times, “Buffalo Rising” is simply offered up as the creator of the article. In either case, the writing is original to Buffalo Rising.

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  • runner68

    I was just talking about the 50’s and 60’s urban planning mindset on the Scajaquada story…Man old habits really do die hard..

  • RaChaCha

    WTAF?
    It would be ridiculous to demolish this great building.  I walked past it just Tuesday night on my way home from the BOE candidates forum, and was thinking what a great adaptive reuse project it will be when it finally gets underway.  I was there for the first time in 2006 on a tour of the Hydraulics with Tim Tielman, and everyone on the tour was in awe of the alleyway at the center of the building.  I remember Tim saying “this would be a great place to film a Spiderman movie” and, yeah, we agreed — it’s one of the most amazing spaces in Buffalo.  I walked through it another time on a Belt Line walk.
    If Krog is so desperate for parking, why not clean up the mess in back of the building, along the Belt Line, and let people park back there?  Better yet — longer term — let’s extend light rail along the Belt Line to the Larkin District, and have the metro stop connected to this building?  That would make this building a Transit-Oriented-Development project (when are we, at long last, going to get some of those going in Buffalo?) and also reduce the overall demand for parking in the district.
    BTW, if you think light rail to the Larkin District sounds like a pipe dream, have you seen the news that a rail excursion is being planned from downtown to Larkin?  And that one of the prime candidates for rail transit expansion is the airport route, that would go through Larkinville?  It’s not a stretch to begin thinking of a rail transit future for Larkinville.  Especially in light of that, to think of sacrificing more great buildings there for parking is just beyond silly.

  • brownteeth

    A lot of assumptions being made here.  Did anyone ask the owner what their intentions are?  How do they know they aren’t rebuilding the wall due to structural issues?  Maybe the contractor was just riling up whoever asked them this question?  I just can’t see any developer demoing anything in this area given the growth and demand right now.

  • LawDogECU

    The truth is probably somewhere in-between.  I doubt they are planning on completey demolishing the building.  Simmer down now!

  • solonggone

    1 – Why does it always seem that the ‘Preservation Community’ is rushing to classify buildings as historic only when they are in danger of coming down?  To many, that shows a lack of perspective and organization and makes it more difficult to take people like Tielman serious. 
    http://rising.wpengine.com/2013/02/webster-block-plan-advances-alternative-vision-floated/
    2 – Why do people instantly get out the pitchforks on developers who say buildings need to come down?  I get that some developers have done horrible things but you need developers to make things work…so it makes sense to seek to understand first.  Especially with a developer who is already working in the area. 
    3 – Comical that Tielman is talking about the fruits of others labor.  Outside of driving around his bus, bitching and getting in the way of developers…he personally has done very little to actually preserve a building. 
    Anyone want to show me where Tim has put a signifiant about of his personal fortune at risk in the preservation of buildings in Greater Buffalo?

  • RaChaCha

    brownteeth  
    I just can’t see any developer demoing anything in this area given the growth and demand right now.
    I would tend to agree, but given that the building across the street is 1M square feet, I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re facing some parking stress during the day.  And look what happened on the other side of the tracks, just in the last couple of years: the development team doing the F.N. Burt Co. buildings were going to demo half that space for parking, but were eventually convinced to walk back from that.  Then, they were going to demo a building on the other side of Hamburg for surface parking, before (apparently) deciding that they would use it for interior parking, instead.
    Also, this news makes me wonder if there might not be some parking skirmishes going on between Seneca Holdings and Larkin Development.  Earlier this year, Seneca Holdings tried making people pay to park in their lot during evening Larkin Square events, and Larkin went online reminding people that parking was always free in the Larkin lots.  Even though it didn’t mention the other lot owner by name, it was nonetheless a gentle admonishment.  That suggests there may be things going on below the radar.
    Another thing that suggests a parking skirmish going on: last fall, after the site of the Larkin Administration Building was paved over for parking, I walked in there for a look around.  When I walked out of the lot and crossed Seneca Street, a fat obnoxious guy in a “Banana Splits” buggy started coming after me, yelling to see my parking pass.  He must have assumed I had parked in the lot.  He literally followed me for a block screaming at me that my car would be towed and I’d be sorry.  Geez!
    So if there’s enough parking stress in the district that it’s leading to these kinds of skirmishes, who knows what someone might get the notion to do?  I wouldn’t put anything past anyone.

  • buffalofalling

    Love the extensive use of hyperbole employed by Tielman and others when it comes to arguing for their side of an argument. The “nation’s legacy”? Really? How so, please expand on this suggestion and educate the unwashed masses about the historic importance this building has to the American story. Why do we bother demolishing buildings and cleaning sites involved in the Manhattan Project, I mean its the nation’s legacy after all, actually the world’s legacy how about that for hyperbole. How dare we remove it and clean it.

  • OldFirstWard

    “Contractors said the building would be demolished “in a month.” Piles of bricks and a wrapped pallet of bricks were photographed by The Campaign.”
    So where are these photos of the bricks and wall? 
    I’ve been waiting to see some activity on this building since the announcement years ago.  (see what I mean about premature announcements).  Is this the same owner that stuccoed in white the former Larkin complex of buildings across the street?  Chunks of the scratch coat mix are already falling off.

  • BuffaloBoi

    Another reason we need NFTA to step up and improve it’s services (expand the metro rail and provide more bus’s and routes). But hey, let’s just keep knocking down buildings for more empty space aka: parking lots since nobody wants to ride ‘public transportation’ in this area and the idea of trying to get ‘locals’ to ditch their cars is laughed at (by the drivers).

  • texpat

    If they need parking they should build a ramp.  That beats surface parking anyway.

  • solonggone

    BuffaloBoi  
    Why do people think it’s always just about parking lots?  Sure they get converted to parking but it’s not like there is a HUGE need for parking and a developer would rather do parking than a structure.
    It’s about Buffalo being POOR.  Period.  If this building was in Brooklyn…the return on any development, both necessary and luxury, would be there.  In Buffalo it’s difficult.  
    Look at how the tax credits are done.  Look at the rents being charged.  Look at the number of new units needed.  Measure all of that against the cost of restoring old buildings and you get your answer.  It’s basic economics.
    If Buffalo wants preservation…great.  Make it so easy even a moron could do it if they had some money.  Make it so there are GREAT PROFITS in restoration.  
    But this won’t happen because outside of being a poor city, people are jealous of those who do have money.  So they don’t want them to have more money.
    To kings to please and only one jester.

  • BuffaloBoi

    solonggone BuffaloBoi  If folks in Buffalo are soooo ‘poor’, then why do they all have cars??????

  • solonggone

    BuffaloBoi
    Because when you can live in a $300k townhouse with your family of 5 that’s subsidized by the taxpayer and you have only to pay $500 a month in rent….you can afford multiple cars.

  • JayDBuffalo

    brownteeth
    why would there be a wrapped pallet of bricks if it was just being demolished? Sounds more like one wall is being repaired.

  • BuffaloBoi

    solonggone BuffaloBoi and don’t forget , they can live in a nice new plastic two story home, but located in the ‘ghetto’. Heck these houses are nicer than most middle class/upper class than in the burbs.

  • rockpile38

    This sounds criminal to me, but people with power & money can get away with shit like this. I don’t like Seneca Holdings LLC./ Krog Corp, even before I saw this posting, I can’t say I know their portfolio but I just never had a good feeling about their business operations, now I know why! If this comes down for surface parking then I’m done with Buffalo. I’ll still enjoy my home and go to local parks but I would never go to the Larkin District again. We all know it’s a sound building, they revealed that when they announced the lofts project! This is how the COB is ran, it’s a 3rd rate city at best, this is proof, we should be building buildings down there not knocking sound historic structures that make up one of our largest business/industrial districts.

  • GotAnyChange

    A lot of these buildings look conducive to a good amount on indoor parking on the first floor. Too bad the parking appetite is insatiable.

  • RaChaCha

    buffalohaha84  
    That comment is all over the spectrum on a continuum from uninformed to ridiculous to spiteful.

  • rockpile38

    RaChaCha  So all people are good & evil little helpless helpers to ‘the campain’ a corrupted paradox of abused over privileged powered bureaucrats wielding their wizardry in a Game Of Thrones, to cast a void of punishment that is purgatory in the twilight of the Netherworld, where all developers are born into slavery & bondage in an apocalyptic Hell Fire, enslaved, beaten, slain, flogged, and tortured with their sheltered, tethered, tar & feathered scars to prove it!  I think that wraps our COB, comic book/video gaming analogy portion on BR for today.

  • RaChaCha

    buffalohaha84
    So you got a comment login here on BRO just to go on this tear?
    Your profile says you’re Paul Kinney who, IINM, is an architect with a well-known architecture firm in the Larkin District — Young + Wright architects.  Headquartered in a rehabbed building in the district.  If that’s who you are, you are also a member of a Green Code committee, and a volunteer with the Buffalo Architecture Foundation.
    So, you’re the last person I’d expect to see here cheering for the demolition of a great, rehab-able building in the district where you work.  And ripping the Campaign for Greater Buffalo, the executive director of which did the concept plan for Larkin Square, across the street from your office.  And, above all, coming off like an ignorant Philistine.
    What’s up with you?  Are you working for Seneca Holdings on a design for a building to replace the powerhouse?  Want an easier time finding a parking space?  Annoyed by the design of Larkin Square?  Or you just woke up this morning and decided to become a hater?

  • GotAnyChange

    I did not get ‘cheering for demolition’ from his comment. Come on now.

  • GotAnyChange

    Yep, That’s the narrative.

  • Black Rock Lifer

    Your exaggeration accounts for a miniscule to non-existent portion of the city’s residents.

  • Black Rock Lifer

    @solong- Your claim “people are jealous of those who do have money” is just nonsense.  Most of us have values and priorities that aren’t centered around accumulating obscene amounts of material wealth. Not saying anyone wants to be poor but this claim of “jealousy” is unfounded and reeks of ignorant classism.

  • Black Rock Lifer

    Angry much? they have medications available for this problem.

  • rockpile38

    GotAnyChange  Yea, everyone is going to have a frustrated rant on here ounce in a while, I just didn’t get his rant. But if there is any truth to this early demo process then it’s no laughing matter, we are just starting to get some things right in the city this would be to big of a mistake to overcome for the Larkin District. and it wouldn’t be a new modern building it would be a medium sized parking ramp, hypothetically speaking.

  • bufguy

    Wow….for an architect who works for an office located in Larkinville that’s a pretty cynical post.
    So….How are you improving the world around you?

  • RaChaCha

    buffalohaha84
    So you’re a different Paul Kinney?  That’s interesting, because a Google search for a “Paul Kinney” in WNY finds mostly references to the architect.  Except for a race car driver who was in a multi-car pileup at Canandaigua Motorsports Park and a school bus driver in Greece, NY, facing 30+ counts of child abuse.
    Despite being a math major in college, I’d have no idea how to calculate the probabilities on this one.

  • brownteeth

    RaChaCha buffalohaha84It’s not exactly an exotic name… and he never once said he for demolition.  Have you been drinking the David Steele koolaid where being devil’s advocate on a demolition topic automatically means your pro demo across the board?  

    Like I said below, there’s an awful lot of speculation going on here based off of very limited and unreliable information.  How does a pallet of bricks equate to demolishing a giant historic building?

  • brownteeth

    RaChaCha brownteethFirst of all, this is not news, its speculation at best.  If it hasn’t been confirmed with the building owner then I wouldn’t get my panties in a bunch.  

    I don’t doubt there’s a need for parking but going from a contractor removing some bricks to a parking lot is a stretch.  Paladino removed all the bricks from the top floor on the southside of the Creamery before they started working.  A more plausible explanation is that they are repairing a wall and the contractor probably didn’t appreciate getting the first degree from a nosey person and made up the story to piss them off.

  • RaChaCha

    brownteeth
    Paul Kinney said, about the purported demolition plans, that the building owner is QUOTE trying to improve the world around them, by doing something, rather than nothing. UNQUOTE
    That sounds pro-demo to me, especially as it’s the kind of thing you so often hear when demolition issues come up.
    Responsively, the rest of my response to your responses will be, responsibly, at the place of your other response.

  • RaChaCha

    brownteeth
    Yeah, there’s enough known unknowns & unknown unknowns here to make a Rumsfeld speech.  As I just said to someone else on Twitter, this could prove to be a fire drill.  But, partly for the reasons I gave you earlier today (above), and partly for a reason I don’t want to say out loud, I think there could be something to this.  I’m glad people aren’t taking any chances, rather than holding back and regretting it (not a perfect analogy, but like the church in North Buffalo that was lost, in part, because a preservation board meeting was cancelled at a crucial juncture).
    I wasn’t able to make the preservation board meeting this afternoon, but will be interested to hear what comes of that.

  • JayDBuffalo

    You mean doing some research and fact checking might have been a good idea before publishing this? Get outta town!

  • solonggone

    Black Rock Lifer  
    Right.  Coming from you…comical.

  • Stateofmind

    buffalohaha84  What a disgusting attack. And, if you ARE in fact Paul, man up, “get a life”, and own your attack. We all should be grateful for the countless buildings still standing, on some of which I am sure you have had the privilege to work, thanks to this group…which stepped up to preserve our architecture before that became a veritable movement.

  • solonggone

    RaChaCha buffalohaha84  
    Like it or not.  Buffalo pretty much has 4 kinds of people.
    1 – Those who make their own money and just want to be left alone by and large.
    2 – Those without any money, who think they have the right to tell others how to spend theirs. 
    3 – Those with some money but don’t risk it…rather use public money and public pressure to tell others how to spend theirs. 
    4 – Those with money who risk it but are attacked left and right by 2 & 3.  
    Tim Tielman, for all of the good he has done, is a pompous windbag.  The good that he has done has really been finding a way to leech off those who are actually risking money in Buffalo AND doing actual work to make it better.  
    Just like Buffalo needing more business owners than Executive Directors of non profits…Buffalo needs more developers than Tim Tielmans.  The fact this this uninformed, and not inaccurate, post when up is a perfect example of just what a problem Buffalo has with development.

  • girlonfastwheels

    JayDBuffalo  Egg, meet face

  • RaChaCha

    solonggone
    So I’m the apologist for Tim Tielman now?  I’m not on his board.
    But consider how many otherwise fine and rehab-able buildings have been lost in Buffalo because of (some) developers not being responsible owners or even outright playing games.  And, in too many cases, the City has been either asleep at the switch or looked the other way.
    As long as those things remain the case, we will have a role and need for watchdogs.  And I’m glad that watchdogging is going on, even if it results in an occasional fire drill.
    Another lesson here: if you’re a big-boy developer, don’t hire butt-stupid contractors who say stupid stuff — like the building is being prepped for demolition when, actually, just the opposite is the case.

  • RaChaCha

    Hey developers: if you want to play in the big leagues, perhaps don’t hire butt-stupid contractors who
    say butt-stupid stuff — like the building is being prepped for demolition
    when, actually, just the opposite is the case. #protip

  • JayDBuffalo

    RaChaCha  
    Eh you dont know the whole story.  Contractor couldve been trying to work and some passerby was annoying the crap out of him.  Said a smart ass comment to make him go away.  As someone who is in construction, other people getting in your way/stopping your work can be pretty annoying.
    Not saying that’s exactly what happened, but this story obviously lacked research.

  • brownteeth

    RaChaCha Or don’t ask the contractor and run erroneous stories without talking to the owner…  looks like my speculation was spot on.

  • brownteeth

    RaChaCha brownteethNo, actually it doesn’t sound like anything specific actually.  You’re reading between the lines as much as the author did.

  • RaChaCha

    brownscanoe
     Contractors who create public relations problems for themselves and their clients…create public relations problems for themselves and their clients.  People are people, and workers who can’t be trusted to interact with the public should be told to leave that to their supervisors — or encouraged to go into animal husbandry, perhaps.
    Not long ago I was taking a gander at an adaptive reuse project going on in my own neighborhood.  The work uncovered a painted ad on the side of the building, and I was standing across the street on the public sidewalk, well out of range of any work, when a guy working on the project came across the street and confronted me.  Scraggly, loud, obnoxious guy who you could hear from a block away got right in my face, screamed at me, and called me names.  I never did anything but look at the building from across the street — not remotely in anyone’s way.
    Contractors who create public relations
    problems for themselves and their clients…create public relations
    problems for themselves and their clients.

  • RaChaCha

    brownteethGloating? Really? I had my doubts about this as well, but I don’t give a rip who was right or wrong about that.  Only that the building isn’t in jeopardy.

  • solonggone

    RaChaCha
    Blaming it on a contractor…that’s pretty freaking weak IYAM.  A couple of calls could have squared the confusion up but BRO is in the business of clicks.  
    As for developers…I am all for saying they need to be responsible but that is weighted against the understanding that development in Buffalo is difficult.  There is a reason why there are so few who actually produce.  
    They also do play games..so do Preservationists.  Tim T runs an extortion racket if you think about it.  It’s selective with preservationists.  BuffaloPundit has covered this before.  
    Beyond the preservation racket, you have the politics, poverty pushers, pastors and countless other ‘non-profits’ and civic groups that all need to wet their beak.  
    Development in Buffalo is dirty and difficult.  For someone who is so involved and with your background, the above comment comes off as pretty naive to be honest.

  • arcmorris

    Calm down everyone!
    So how did this message chain get so out of whack?  Here is my take on this:
    Poorly researched and incendiary story gets posted this morning and corrected (retracted) the same day once someone has the presence of mind to interview the owner.
    Yawn!

  • JohnMarko

    JayDBuffalo RaChaCha Which is a BIG no no in the the construction industry.  ANYONE ON THE PROJECT KEEPS THEIR DAMN MOUTH SHUT!  Whether they are other junior Architects or Engineers working on a project representing their firm, or workers on the job.  NEVER, EVER GIVE YOUR OPINION ON THE JOB.
    This is the major cause of job related conflicts, when actually, there is no “there” there..  Even “innocent” jokes often do mushroom to major incidences.  Some moron tried to get a worker in trouble for “threatening me” on a job once when I knew he was just joking (about “killing” me for constantly reminding him when his work was defective (holes in walls, etc.)  This was the “banter” he did with me, and I took it as such. The idiot(s) who “reported” this were in deep trouble.
    This dumb contractor, if he did say this, is an idiot if he did say this “in passing”.

  • RaChaCha

    HEY ALL: let’s not breathe too deep a sigh of relief about the powerhouse — nor too soon.  THIS in The Buffalo News:
    http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/development/stop-work-order-placed-on-larkin-district-building-20140424

  • paulbuffalo

    1. This entire article and the comments should be deleted from the site.
    2. Articles on BRO should always list the author and not Posted by ‘BuffaloRising’.  BR has been around long enough to avoid these unfortunate incidents.  Step up.

  • RaChaCha

    paulbuffalo  
    Except that, as it turns out, the alarm was rightly sounded.  Check out this recently posted Buffalo News article, giving the actions taken by the City administration and the preservation board today:
    http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/development/stop-work-order-placed-on-larkin-district-building-20140424

  • OldFirstWard

    So where are the pictures of the bricks and wall?   Those do exist.  I drove over there today and saw nothing.   But as I earlier posted, as soon as I read this thread I was looking for the pics.  When no links or pics appeared, I immediately became skeptical about the article.  
    I actually love the passion pouring out in this thread.  For the record, I fully support Tim Tielman.  A stand up man.

  • Michael DiPasquale

    This is obviously an “unknown unknown”.

  • bufguy

    OMG…So glad Tom Yots was assured that the bricks were being palletized for “structural analysis”
    You do not need pallets of bricks for analysis….you need one!…They were harvesting  the brick for resale,
    Instead of relying on the “assurances” of the contractor, the Buffalo Preservation Board unanimously voted to nominate Larkinville, including the power house for landmarking…If the owner opposes, his true intentions will be made public.

  • bufguy

    buffalohaha84 I hope Shawn Wright and Jerry Young read these comments…Your opinions may cause unintended consequences to their potential business

  • TheNextMayor

    Krog admited to the Buffalo News demolition and a parking lot is being considered. I personally saw the bricks being removed from the wall. 
    Also, Krog constructed the hideous looking parking lots across the street without site plan review (as required) and they’re surrounded with barbed-wire fencing (which is prohibited.) 
    His track record isn’t exactly award winning. He deserves the scrutiny.

  • EB_Blue

    What’s jumping the gun is this headline. The crew told me Tuesday the bricks were
    being harvested for use in the building across the street. Krog tells the
    Buffalo News today (http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/development/stop-work-order-placed-on-larkin-district-building-20140424) that demolition is an option that’s being weighed.
    Contractors say without any hesitation that absolutely it’s slated for
    demolition within “weeks.” Tielman is absolutely justified in his concern, and landmarking the Larkin Co. buildings is the right
    move.

  • TheNextMayor  
    so…maybe the loose-lipped demo contractor was right, and krog was trying to cover his tracks as best as he could?

  • Black Rock Lifer

    @solong- My wife and I are both professionals, we earn enough to live any lifestyle we choose, I know you don’t understand, way over your head.

  • brownteeth

    RaChaCha brownteethI don’t really care who was right or wrong either, and I too am glad its not in jeopardy.  I just hate the knee jerk reactions without having facts.

  • RaChaCha

    brownteeth
    I hear ya! And I swear I’m not gloating, but this building ain’t out of the woods yet — this in The Buffalo News:
    http://www.buffalonews.com/city-region/development/stop-work-order-placed-on-larkin-district-building-20140424
    Painting for Preservation will be there Sunday.

  • Northbuff

    It really sucks that some developers advertise their ambitious development plans only for the public to find out months or years later that the building is not structurally sound and the development may not be feasable. Have they not heard of due diligence?
    Hopefully Krog does not pull this stunt on the Trico building.

  • Captain Picard

    Tim Toolman and his merry men have done it again.

  • AllentownChris

    Time to get an independent engineering inspection before something bad happens to the building.

  • it sure is staring to look like tielman was right to sound the alarm and krog might have been hoping to pull off a stealth demolition.  as bufguy said, you don’t palletize bricks for “structural analysis.” good catch, bufguy.  bricks, once removed, tell you nothing about a building’s structural integrity.

  • KevinChristner

    RaChaCha Maybe you shouldn’t libel people without confirming who they are.  Typical preservationist tactic.  I would also point out that you hide behind an alias.  Why don’t you let us know who you are if you aren’t afraid of the consequences of your attacks.

  • brownscanoe  
    normally i’d agree with you.  but buffalo has a long and sordid record of consequence-free, illegal stealth demolitions (harbor inn, fitch creche, to name two).

  • pfk67

    If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck…. it’s a duck.  Krog has put too many details in his statement like….”We have a parking problem there.”  and if it can’t be saved, it wont.  “If he does demolish it he’ll put a parking lot in its place.”
    Don’t be fooled.  That’s what he wants to do.  My thoughts, similar to those in the fruit belt, are that there is vacant land all around that place.  Parking a block away is not a big deal.  If you go to NYC, parking can be 5-6 blocks away.  People will find a way if they like it.  
    Anyway,  I’ve learned to peak into people’s statements a little closer as I have aged and I believe with this one, the proof is in the pudding.

  • rockpile38

    Krog Corp’s gotta go! What the hell do they need so much parking for, his building has basically the same tenants, and they built all that parking in back, which could be a 2/3 story ramp! I’m glad Mr. Teilman and the preservation board jumped in but just the fact that a developer would think he could do this is disturbing. I wonder what Mr. Zemsky thinks of all this sneaking around.

  • solonggone

    A building beyond repair is a subjective term.
    No building is beyond repair as someone with an unlimited amount of resources and in a market with demand would be able to restore any structure.  Buffalo, however, does not have developers with unlimited amount of resources and the market is not one that any and all properties fills up the moment they are completed.  
    Once people grasp this and start bitching about and trying to fix the issues that cause this with the same effort as they bring out the pitchforks when a developer does not do what they want…maybe then something will change.

  • rockpile38

    solonggone  How long has the building been standing, 120 years? And how much would it cost to demo such a large building? Your right about the limited resources and the COB being poor etc. but this city&region does not maximize it’s resources & potential, the East Side, Niagara Falls, and the huge gaps of surface parking lots along with the slew of 1 to 2 story 1980’s crap buildings that fill up the Elm/Oak Corridor are proof of that. We are still catering to a dying suburban culture, god forbid someone has to walk across the street to go to work in a cozy office building. All we have are these buildings and what they represent, it’s the reason we are all on here  Anything or anyone that has to do with demoing Buffalo has already won the fight, battle, and the war so let’s save these buildings/homes by all means possible!

  • bfranklin

    rockpile38  Should they go before or after they finish Trico?  I don’t claim any knowledge about his intentions with regard to the Larkin Lofts, but I’d be a bit leery of making him out to be a villain.  If demolition was not his intention, the experience of this misunderstanding might cause any individual to rethink his intended course of action.

  • rockpile38

    bfranklin  Your right we don’t know for sure about what’s going on over there, but with all that seems to be surfacing it appears that they have intentions of a possible demo. And hasn’t there been speculation about Krog Corp’s intentions with Trico. We’ll see how it plays out.

  • solonggone

    rockpile38
    FWIW, I am not suggesting it should be a demo.  It can be saved…provided the economics work.  
    My point was instead of standing around these buildings and doing paintings….people should work on action items that could actually help save them.

  • rockpile38

    solonggone rockpile38 know you were, and I agree 1000%! I was thinking that for my self, instead of being fed up and burying my head in the sand, I’ll get involved with this one! There was a lot of action to save Trico and that worked out, so far, and that never got land mark status which I would believe the Powerhouse will, being such a significant building in the Larkin/Hydraulics District!

  • 300miles

    If they “can’t”  (i.e. “won’t”) fix it, they plan to tear it down for a parking lot?    This is typical old-school BullShit.    If they can’t fix it they should sell it to someone that will.    No more surface lots.    Tim Tielman was 100% correct to raise the alarm on this.

  • Captain Picard  
    yes, thank goodness.  this city is a far better place because of him.

  • gblakowski

    If Carl Paladino can reserect the Fairmont Creamery bldg., surly the Larkin Powerhouse can be saved. Where there is a will, there is a way.

  • keetz4

    Are there any preservation engineers who can determine exactly how serious the foundation failure is?

  • OldFirstWard

    You gotta love that corner swatch of the building that was cleaned some years ago to get a feel of effect and color.  The closeup pic of the wall is brilliant and full of character.  The imperfections, color variances, and patina can only come through with a proper scrubbing.  
    The upper pic in the thread title is a perfect example of why the Phoenix Brewing Building needs to be cleaned.  There is no beauty to soot and grime.

  • AllentownChris

    OldFirstWard  I think that brick has been damaged, a good example of how not to clean brick. Once the surface crust of the brick is compromised, the rest just crumbles.

  • bufguy

    OldFirstWard You have to be really careful cleaning brick…low pressure water, a light detergent or possibly a poultice to draw the dirt out.
    Many a building has been damaged by sandblasting or harsh chemicals..The fired surface becomes porous allowing moisture to be absorbed…Too much moisure gets in, freezes and the brick literally explodes.
    .

  • OldFirstWard

    bufguy
    That is why they make breathable sealers.  
    Paladino power washed the Creamery Building last fall from top to bottom.   Rocco Termini cleans all his rehabs. However the FWS Building took a beating from the sandblasting used to remove the hideous gray paint. From the street it looks magnificent.

  • bufguy

    OldFirstWard bufguySealers only last so long and once you compromise the fired surface of the brick it is much more susceptible to moisture…As far as cleaning I hope Paladino followed the Department of Interior Standards…
    http://www.nps.gov/tps/how-to-preserve/briefs/1-cleaning-water-repellent.htm
    Check it out its interesting reading

  • 300miles

    OldFirstWard bufguy    I hope they apply that sealer you mentioned to the FWS building… the brick seems very exposed now.