City October 10, 2012 11:05 AM

Cheektowaga's New Super Walmart: Good News for Buffalo, Bad News for the Region

Cheektowaga’s New Super Walmart: Good News for Buffalo, Bad News for the Region

This post originally appeared on Views of Buffalo

You're probably asking yourself how anyone could possibly fathom that Cheektowaga's new Super Walmart on Walden Avenue will be good for the City of Buffalo. In the spirit of making you a believer, let's review the basics of a typical Walmart. Disposable and unidentifiable architecture, purely suburban design, a parking lot often exponentially larger than the store, and often a detriment to small, locally owned businesses.

There has been a lot of debate whether or not Walmart is actually good or bad when it comes to town, but that's a larger discussion for another time. I'd like to focus on the long-term impacts of their unsustainable model in Western New York.

When the Sheridan Drive Super Walmart opened and replaced the Walmart on Niagara Falls Boulevard, rumor has it that the company intentionally left it vacant. The underlying thought is to avoid any competition from similar stores, even if it means another dead plaza in the suburbs. The same thing is likely to happen in Lockport on Transit Road when their new Super Walmart opens. I'd be willing to bet that the Cheektowaga at the former Thruway Mall is in store for pretty much the same.

However, the BN article mentions that Benderson Development will be searching for a new tenant for the "soon to be old" Walmart further down Walden Avenue, so there may still be hope. Additionally, residents have been complaining for quite some time about conditions of the Super Flea and the "criminal activity" problems. The hope is that the new use of the site will reduce crime, but that doesn't seem likely given the precedent set by the other stores.

Since the new Super Walmart has opened on Sheridan, Amherst Police have been on site regularly to deal with criminal activity and unruly patrons. Although Walmart is replacing Super Flea, it will likely not be able to alter the patterns of crime and other associated issues if the Sheridan Drive store is any proof.

So why is all this good news for Buffalo? Simple, because it isn't happening in the city. Cheektowaga is losing an interesting and unique attraction and replacing it with something that can be found in "Anywhere, America." The Super Flea may not be the prettiest place, but it's a fun place to spend a weekend afternoon hunting for rare or interesting items.

Even better for Buffalo, the Peddler Market in the city has the same spirit of the Super Flea, but in an urban setting. It's not hard to imagine that those who enjoy visiting and spending money at the Super Flea may now be coming into Buffalo after Super Walmart comes to Walden Avenue.

Every poor decision the suburbs make about their built environment, the better Buffalo looks. We have unique destinations, attractions, history, and landscapes that the burbs cannot replicate. Each time one of the few, interesting attractions disappears for something that can be found just about anywhere, Buffalo reestablishes itself as the more interesting alternative. The current generation has been flocking back to cities to escape the endless sea of parking lots and uninteresting places that are typical of America's suburbs.

It's not all good news though.  This type of development hurts us all as a region. No one is really thinking or discussing the long-term consequences of having dozens of dead plazas throughout the area. What the region is going to be left with in a few years are miles upon miles of asphalt parking lots and more empty stores.

Walden Avenue is one of the worst offenders. It's nearly impossible to find a single building between Harlem and Cayuga that doesn't have parking in front of it or a building that isn't set back significantly from the street. I often wonder why they even bothered spending the money on sidewalks. It's Urban Planning 101 to have a mix of uses in an urban setting with buildings "built to the curb" in order to create an interesting and lively streetscape.

Unfortunately, Buffalo also suffers from poor design choices modeled after suburban principles. Look no further than the newer builds on Delaware Avenue by Kenmore. These buildings are mediocre architecturally and the site plan is purely suburban; parking in the front with buildings significantly set back from the sidewalk. It's quite the contrast looking further down Delaware in Kenmore, where most of the buildings were designed with the pedestrian in mind rather than the car. The good news here is that there is less of it to "fix" in the city than there is in the suburbs.

Like many problems in our built environment, it's possible to fix the poor design of the suburban commercial corridors, but the price tag would be enormous. Just imagine how much it would cost to rebuild everything along Walden to be pedestrian friendly with parking in the rear, a road diet for the street, and architecture that actually means something. It's much easier and much more gratifying to fix up the city than to rebuild the suburbs with a better design. What we have now in Buffalo, no matter what the condition, is typically better built and more interesting than anything being built along commercial corridors in the suburbs.

I'll leave you with one final thought on the subject to reflect upon or discuss. During my time at UB, several professors consistently told me that no one cares about architecture anymore. I bought it; it made sense. Look at the majority of what's built today compared to that of 50+ years ago.

Since graduating, I've decided on a new line of thinking, people don't care about architecture because most of what we build today doesn't deserve to be cared about. Every time one of these characterless, fake, disposable structures are built and labeled architecture, it only further reinforces that statement. Architecture is, and has been, a field in crisis and buildings like this only make it worse.

Entry Image: Courtesy of Google Maps. New Super Walmart at Sheridan and Bailey Avenue.


Niagara Falls.jpg

The former location on Niagara Fall Boulevard is now a half dead, massive plaza
Image courtesy of Google Maps


IMG_7142
This small plaza on Delaware Avenue by Kenmore presents another lost opportunity in Buffalo to
create an interesting, walkable, pedestrian-friendly, streetscape. It was as simple as locating
the buildings at the sidewalk and moving parking to the rear

IMG_7144
This is Delaware Avenue just a few blocks from the previous picture, in the Village of Kenmore. This is 
how cities and urban areas were built and should continue with this model. You can walk right
off the sidewalk into a store without the risk of walking through a parking lot. The greatly
improved aesthetics are also a great bonus.

View image

Comments

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I agree, WalMart sucks.

Score: 8 ( 30 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Except when it's real early Saturday morning and you need a fishing license.

Except when you're traveling and you're in some unfamiliar territory and realize you forgot to pack socks.

Except when you just need something simple and don't want to think about it, or are dead-broke and don't have the money to pay Mom & Pop.

Then you hate walking around in there, but you do it anyway because it solves your immediate problem.

replied to LI2Northpark
Score: 2 ( 50 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

You are probably dead broke because you work at Walmart.

replied to Jesse
Score: -17 ( 49 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

....OR...perhaps you're a senior citizen, have little savings, need a job, because you cant keep ends meet, and you dont qualify for HEAP, SOC. SERVICES, or perhaps most of the jobs have disappeared due to economic conditions...but maybe....STEEL ...you're hiring??!

replied to STEEL
Score: 11 ( 25 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

You against people working?

replied to STEEL
Score: 0 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

I am no fan of Wal-Mart or any big box perpetrator but I can relate to both sides of the argument and wonder if Wal-Mart Corporation were to be enticed into opening a store in the former AM&A’s would we naysayers change our opinions of them?

replied to LI2Northpark
Score: -1 ( 3 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

This is a stretch: "Even better for Buffalo, the Peddler Market in the city has the same spirit of the Super Flea, but in an urban setting. It's not hard to imagine that those who enjoy visiting and spending money at the Super Flea may now be coming into Buffalo after Super Walmart comes to Walden Avenue."

Score: 6 ( 24 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

This.

This Pure Michigan parody video sums up the environment at Super Flea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDCCcxlKzDU

replied to Joe E.V.
Score: 2 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Which part of this did you think a stretch? When I first heard that the market would be closing, I thought it might open up a possibility for a larger market downtown.

replied to Joe E.V.
Score: 5 ( 9 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Just what everybody wants to see downtown! A flea market where you can get Chinese mystery brand snow tires, mall ninja gear, Chinese mystery brand pot metal tools, bling, used Playboys, VHS tapes that Video Factory used to rent out, Chinese mystery brand car stereo equipment, used Hustlers, CRT monitors, "designer" fragrances, last year's cell phones, baggy jeans, Chinese mystery brand cleaning supplies, more bling, dollar store crap, used Nintendo games, closeout CDs, tattoos, Chinese off-brand workwear, white box computers running pirated copies of Windows XP, "smoking accessories", disposable sunglasses, airbrushed t-shirts, used Penthouses, incense, airsoft guns, even more bling, wigs, artificial nails, counterfeit urban fashion, fiber optic "art", cell phone cases, "designer" purses, used Leg Shows, and bling.

replied to benfranklin
Score: 8 ( 14 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

guess you haven't been on elmwood recently. we have exactly this store between hodge & utica.

replied to Dan
Score: 8 ( 8 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

The Wal-Mart argument is old. People that like Wal-Mart are going to go there people that don't aren't.

If price is all that matters to you, you will brave the crowds, scary people, and junk filled racks.

Most of the small busineses owners who couldn't differiencate themselves from Wal-Mart and the other big boxers are gone. If anything, small businesses are coming back and differientating themselves.

As long as a WalMart and its parking oceans doesn't try building in downtown who cares.

Score: 14 ( 30 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

great post.
One can only hope that Buffalo's long sought new building codes or "Green Code" will address this issue at least in the city limits. Buildings should always be built to sidewalk and have any available parking in back.

Score: 6 ( 14 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

It's kind of a weird argument to say that the degradation of a first ring suburb is good for the city because the degradation is happening outside of city lines.

Score: 21 ( 27 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

That said, Wal-mart is a the poster child with what is wrong with the US capitalism these days. Outsourced junk, Exploited workers, exploited gov't and destruction left behind to benefit a few rich

replied to NorthBuf
Score: 24 ( 38 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Maybe true, but the biggest beneficiaries of wal mart putting downward pressure on suppliers and not paying their employees very well are the masses who shop there. I don't really agree with what they do but the stuff is super cheap and people like that. Plus, the wal mart in hamburg really stepped up to the plate architecturally by taking a cue from the Parthenon with those classy columns ; ).

replied to NorthBuf
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Great observations

Score: -1 ( 19 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Great post. The infrastructure for big box stores is subsidized by all of us. We all pay for the over-sized roads (no, gasoline taxes do not completely pay for roads and road maintenance) that make it possible for such stores to exist and Walmarts take advantage of that and offer those with automobiles low prices for cheap merchandise produced in
China.

Score: 2 ( 16 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

not to mention making for the super low wages in the form of safety net subsidies.

replied to Daniel Sack
Score: 1 ( 11 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

This is not good for the City of Buffalo or anyplace else in the region, no matter where it is built. Its just continued proliferation of economically unsustainable development of the worst kind. These stores do nothing but drain money out of local economies while providing almost nothing in return, in terms of quality products or the built environment. Meanwhile, a new massive retail space will be constructed, while vacating another massive retail space - all within an economy and population that is on the 50 year decline.

These developments are bad all the way around - and that has nothing to do with what you think of WalMart. Its BAD development, locally and regionally. Yet we're just stupid enough to keep it up because we like to buy our shampoo for $0.49.

Score: 9 ( 15 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

A lot of the big box shuffling can be avoided if Buffalo's suburbs had architectural and landscaping standards, like the 'burbs of peer cities elsewhere. It might increase the cost of construction somewhat, but it also makes their buildings less disposable. You're more likely to stick around and get your money's worth out of a building, and it increases the building and site more attractive for reuse.

When a building is designed for one user in mind, with strong "trade dress", it's difficult for any new tenants to develop an identity of their own. They'll always be "the Greek restaurant in the old Taco Bell" or "the florist in the old Red Barn".

Sure, the result might still be vehicle-oriented sprawl, but for suburban communities that continue to shun contemporary best practices in planning, some 1980s-style architectural and site planning regulations will at least help to stabilize the strips.

Score: 5 ( 7 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Yes, Yes, Yes "Wal*Mart sucks" we know this. Have for quite awhile. The plus side to this is that that over run cockroach factory will be torn down and a future empty warehouse will be constructed in it's place. Let them have it, who cares. The land of the crabapple is Cheektowaga, so let all those jaded baby boomer folk have their Wal*Mart yall, then they can go to Alton's for a nice rib eye dinner after.

Score: 5 ( 15 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Frankly, I'm not buying this argument. The premise, if I'm understanding it correctly, is "the Buffalo suburbs are sucking more and more; therefore, people will move into the city of Buffalo which, by contrast, looks better."

The problem with this argument is it's ignoring the fact there's a third option: people can instead choose to move to suburbs better than Buffalo's. This, by far, would be the most likely scenario compared to the notion that families will all of a sudden deciding to trade in a traditional suburban lifestyle for the "urban" lifestyle of Buffalo.

Other cities have (primarily first ring) suburbs that have grown much more urban (or "urban-lite," depending on your opinion), where you have incorporated a walkable lifestyle, density, amenities, but also have retained things still rare in many cities (lower crime, better schools, better tree cover, etc.). It's a great slice of both worlds - that's what America's 21st century suburb looks like. Buffalo's suburbs doubling-down on gross, 1960-90s principles isn't going to help the city of Buffalo - it's going to help add population to other suburbs outside WNY.

Score: 12 ( 18 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

This will be a setback in Cheektowaga's efforts to stabilize the Pine Ridge neighborhood, which has a built environment that more closely resembles an old East Side neighborhood like Broadway-Fillmore than the Cape Cod and ranch-filled subdivisions east of Harlem Road. This move further isolates what is essentially an urban neighborhood from shopping and employment opportunities.

On the plus side, if the power center that replaces "da Troowayplaza" ultimately empties out, it could provide a site that would give the Town a second chance at building a New Urbanism-based community.

Score: 4 ( 8 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

there's a really good graphic here showing how a big box store fronted by parking can be brought to the sidewalk without sacrificing that many parking spaces.

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/housing/2012/10/tips-selling-urban-experience-suburbanites/3527/

scroll down about 1/3.

Score: 6 ( 6 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Not sure if there is a connection between Cheektowaga's degradation and the city's ability to draw in retailers. Although, we have seen small shops become apart of the Elmwood district, and even in the downtown area with retail space in renovated buildings such as the Hotel @ at the Lafayette.

Score: 4 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

There is a place for both. Show me a store on Elmwood or Delaware where you can buy laundry detergent or toilet paper. Also consider that in both good and bad economies, people need to wipe their ass and wash their clothes.

Furthermore, it's a bit obnoxious to say that cheap retail is bad for the COB based on the notion that it saves architecture and prevents parking. The reason is the majority of the COB can not afford to shop on Elmwood or Delaware.

Score: 3 ( 25 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

You can buy both laundry detergent on Elmwood Avenue at the Elmwood Market, the Lexington Coop, 24-hour store and 7-11. Its reasonably priced at all of those stores, the Coop being a bit more expensive because of the specialty products they provide. Are you suggesting I can't get that stuff anyplace else than WalMart or a similar megamart?

replied to longgone
Score: 3 ( 13 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Reasonable is an opinion. If you think the pricing for TP on Elmwood is comparable to a Wal-Mart then I have some land for you to buy on the East Side at a reasonable price.

Even if you can find items, a 8pk of TP is not the same as a family pack. So yes, getting products in specific packages are only available at stores like this. Again, you're thinking of this from the perspective of your or my income..not a family struggling.

I am all for urban shopping. I live in an urban environment because I like this lifestyle. I am assuming you feel the same.

My greater point is Buffalo, no matter how you want to package it, is not 100% urban. Just because it's in the City does not mean it's urban. I can think of multiple locations in the city that would benefit by having a mega mart.

I also do not think these places compete with each other. The customers have too much of a variance in profile. When was the last time you had people take the bus from Rodney and Fillmore or the First Ward to the Elmwood strip to do some shopping?

I think there are 4-5 areas of the city that can eventually become self sustaining urban neighborhoods. The rest of the city should be left to grow as suburban style.

replied to townline
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While I'd think it's very debatable to say prices at 7-11 or 24 Hour store are 'reasonable' for most types of everyday products like longgone mentioned, there are other options in city parts of Delaware and Elmwood addition to those.

So townline's point looks correct, even if at stores some of you guys might not like, including examples (south to north)
Delaware - Walgreens, Rite Aid, Big Lots, Target
Elmwood - Family Dollar, Price Rite, CVS, Dollar General, Tops, Aldi

With all those plus what townline mentioned, it seems like a good amount.

replied to townline
Score: 2 ( 2 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

* laundry detergent and toilet paper..

replied to longgone
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wegmans just west of elmwood at amherst! do i get a prize?

replied to longgone
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Great post, Mike. It's unfathomable to me how far behind the times developers in Buffalo can be. WAKE THE $%$# UP and travel a little!!!

Score: -4 ( 14 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Yes, parking in the rear and having the building touch the sidewalk is the best use of buildings.....Price Rite is a great example...Not blaming Price rite cause the building has always been there..

Score: 2 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

I disagree.

The good news would have been if a Walmart Superstore were located somewhere near a Light Rail Station or proposed Light Rail Extention so that those in the city or suburbs along the route could have carless access.

There will always be cars for these types of big box stores. Who is going to carry a 42" TV under their arms as they walk home.

However, having a superstore light rail accessible would be nearly as good as having such a store downtown.

Score: 1 ( 9 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Walmart is capable of designing something urban friendly with minimized parking.

http://greatergreaterwashington.org/post/14555/walmarts-6-dc-stores-some-will-be-urban-some-wont/

I don't see this coming to WNY any time soon...

replied to paulsobo
Score: 3 ( 5 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

It could be an option for WNY if leadership was smart and required smarter development standards. If Walmart refused to follower higher level standards in WNY would the loss of an extra super store really be that big of a deal?

replied to Mike Puma
Score: 2 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

"There will always be cars for these types of big box stores. Who is going to carry a 42" TV under their arms as they walk home."

There is a thing called "delivery" that used to play a much greater role before everyone had oversized SUVs, trucks, and minivans.

replied to paulsobo
Score: 6 ( 10 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Who is going to ride a train with a 42" LCD under their arm? Or a huge grocery carts worth of items? Afterall it's the bulk items that are cheapest. Riding any public transpo would be miserable after shopping for those items.

replied to paulsobo
Score: 6 ( 8 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

I agree...with Buffalo lacking in population density, plenty of infill available and easy road access...you wont see a discount retailer with their margins putting up a parking garage to be more urban friendly.

The best we can hope for regarding urban friendliness is to have a Walmart Superstore accessible via Light Rail. This would make low prices and high selection of the store available to all those dependent upon mass transit for their daily living.

Its why I think a big dynamic of eastside livability and viability depends upon a Light Rail access to the Airport. It would be pretty much guarranteed that Broadway Market, Galleria and a Walmart Superstore would be accessible for downtown and the near eastside.

Score: -1 ( 5 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Many times, articles on BR are worth the time to read.

This is not one of them.

Score: 0 ( 16 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Why not?

replied to Urban Cowboy
Score: -1 ( 9 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Poor decisions in the burbs don't make Buffalo(city) better. It doesn't make it look more attractive or bring anything new to the table. I just don't agree with the article.

The Super Flea Market closing is not making the city better.

replied to STEEL
Score: 3 ( 9 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

You did not read the whole story

replied to Urban Cowboy
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Ahh - it's Sheridan DRIVE, not Sheridan "Road".

Only if communities FORCE them to do so, wallyworld will build urban friendlier stores.

The one in central Honolulu is a prime example. Parking is all covered, or on the "roof" with a Sam's Club on the second level. It is built from "sidewalk to sidewalk" on all sides.

Granted, the expanse of the store along Keeaumoku Street and the other streets is not much better than Main Place Mall, with the covered multistory parking garage taking half the length of the streetscape, but at least it's not a giant street-fronting open parking lot in the middle of the city.

But it's very "clean" and the streetscape is lined with nice large trees, so the walk along it is actually quite pleasant.

Score: 1 ( 1 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Speaking of good "to the curb" design, here's the "new" Safeway plaza complex on Kapahulu Avenue near Waikiki - the big Safeway store is in the back of the parking lot - with roof top parking and small shops along side in a "U" on each side to the street/sidewalk, with more shops fronting the street and blocking the parking lot from the parking lot. I could kick myself for failing to take pics when I was there. The development is very neighborhood/walking friendly - I walked there almost every other day for groceries, etc. from a couple blocks away. The only "gripe" is the increase in traffic along that part of the street. They added a couple new stoplights to control the traffic exiting/entering the plaza.

http://www.loopnet.com/Attachments/5/8/7/xy_5876F068-25D0-4AE7-9449-E51CD0DE7BAA__.jpg

Score: 0 ( 0 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

Let me ask you this: How much is land in central Honolulu? How much is land in Cheektowaga? That's a big difference. So are we supposed to tell Walmart that they can't build their new supercenter because it has too much parking or that they won't build it to the curb on a road no one walks along? I suppose Cheektowaga could try to tell them that and see where it goes, but I doubt that would get them anywhere with Walmart, and I seriously doubt that the town would be willing to risk losing the tax revenue from the store.

replied to JohnMarko
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Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

My comments were directed to URBAN areas like the City of Buffalo and Village of Kenmore, not suburban/rural areas like Cheektowaga.

BUT, YES, anyplace can DEMAND Good Design. If wallyworld doesn't want to play by OUR rules, then they don't get to play in our neighborhoods and WE don't NEED them.

If wallyworld really wants to be in a particular area, they will abide by any rules the area demands. It's not rocket science. And if they refuse to come into an area that demands excellence in design then we BOTH win - wallyworld doesn't have to expand into and area, and the local stores in and area and the community at large wins!

It only takes a strong will on the part of the community.

replied to pampiniform
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Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

My comments were directed to URBAN areas like the City of Buffalo and Village of Kenmore, not suburban/rural areas like Cheektowaga.

BUT, YES, anyplace can DEMAND Good Design. If wallyworld doesn't want to play by OUR rules, then they don't get to play in our neighborhoods and WE don't NEED them.

If wallyworld really wants to be in a particular area, they will abide by any rules the area demands. It's not rocket science. And if they refuse to come into an area that demands excellence in design then we BOTH win - wallyworld doesn't have to expand into and area, and the local stores in and area and the community at large wins!

It only takes a strong will on the part of the community.

replied to pampiniform
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Said it before, I'll say it again: this retail you love to hate has its place. And the sea of parking is really inoffensive to a big majority of shoppers.

I love the Elmwood Ave Home Depot, Office Depot, Value stores and Delaware Ave Target and Kohl's stores. We shop there and Wegmans and Tops and KMart, etc. Sure they're built like suburban stores. Guess what? I like that! They're convenient. Hop in the car, five minutes to the store (we live off Elmwood near Amherst), in, out, back home. We're right off the expressway and right down the street from big boxes we frequent. Doesn't get much more convenient.

What the hell's your huge problem with cars and parking? I fail to see how these big box stores have hurt Buffalo at all. I argue the opposite. They have helped this area of Buffalo become more competitive in the residential marketplace. Hertel Ave is doing better today than it did 15 years ago. This isn't in spite of those big boxes. It is in part because of them. Those big boxes make living in this part of the city convenient. Because it's convenient the rooftops get occupied. Because there's so much density (helped by the new retail boxes and plaza which replaced decrepit factories) Hertel Ave can support other businesses.

I live off Elmwood near Wegman's. I have no problem with the set back of that store, way back there behind the sea of parking and grass. I like walking past it, with that large swath of green grass between me and the parking. We shop there several times a week because it's right around the corner.

And, as I've pointed out before, the Value Plaza at Hertel and Elmwood is built right up to Hertel. And it looks like scheiss.

Where you look at a parking lot in front of a retail box and see blight, I see convenience. The aesthetics of Elmwood between Kenmore and Hertel do not offend me.

Score: 8 ( 16 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

'convenience' is a moving target.

these places are going to lose their 'convenience' mighty fast when gas hits $5. every day there is less oil in the ground and more demand from india and china. when demand exceeds supply, prices rise. welcome to the free market, folks. our president, whoever we elect next month, cannot do anything about it.

as more and more people get priced out of driving everywhere all the time, they are very much going to resent walking across a dead zone of parking just to get their laundry detergent. it is not just an aesthetic issue, it is a safety issue. walmart parking lots are notoriously crime-ridden places.

compounding that are the demographics of erie county: we're an increasingly older bunch, and if we're lucky, we'll outlive our driving skills. we will need shops and services within walking distance.

when you get to that age, bini, i hope we'll have successfully extended your independence by building lots of 'inconvenient' places that don't require a car.

replied to biniszkiewicz
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re: places I can shop when I'm old and feeble: they have lots of such places now. They're called on line stores. I shop there a lot, too.

I also frequent Guercio's, Spar's, Luigi's, others. I have nothing against good small shops. But I spend more at Home Depot in a year than I do in the small shops combined.

replied to grad94
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when gas is $5 or $10, cheap merchandise from china and cheap delivery will be a thing of the past.

replied to biniszkiewicz
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grad, that might be wishful thinking.

Canada's price per gallon is up near $5, and in some provinces (like BC) already over $5.50 now.
Yet WM Canada seems to be thriving.
"Oct. 9, 2012 - Walmart Canada announced today it will embark on its biggest month of grand openings in its history. By the end of October, the company will complete 30 real estate projects. … The 30 stores employ more than 3,000 associates and represent an addition of nearly 2.4 million square feet of retail space.
"This is an exciting month for Walmart Canada," said Jim Thompson, chief operations officer. "We are Canada's fastest growing retailer...."


Perhaps the higher energy prices go, maybe all the more that people want to save as much as they can on everything else, thus even more likely to bigbox.

replied to grad94
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UPS is moving to trucks that operate on compressed air. You read that right: compressed air. High pressure tanks get filled by compressors at the warehouse, then the trucks run around all day on air.

Electric vehicles are on the consumer market. They're not selling well, because people are still willing to pay near $5/gallon for gas instead of incurring the added purchase cost and untested technology of electrics, but the electrics will become popular as gas continues to rise and as their technology becomes more trusted.

Fuel economy on American cars is mandated to double in the next decade or so. So even if gas prices double, the net effect will be the same costs for fuel as today.

High gas prices will not undo car ownership. It will only change the technology of the engines. People value the freedom the vehicle offers them. They will not stand at a bus stop in the snow and rain, enduring the endless stops and transfers. It ain't gonna happen. Hope and yearn all you want for the nation to become Manhattan, but be prepared to be disappointed.

replied to grad94
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The saddest thing is most of these big box retail locations were factories and warehouses. Those produced real high wage jobs that supported these neighborhoods.

How can we make the city and its inner ring neighborhoods viable? We like to talk about neighborhood businesses but no one is going to buy a TV from a local merchant if its not a comparable price to a big box store. There was a reason those mom&pop stores died. They couldnt compete even with top notch service.

Bringing back factory, warehouse and knowledge based jobs back in the city? Thats a separate topic for discussion until then the city is only viable if it can be as cheap yet convenient as the suburbs.

Thats where a Light Rail extension is critical to the viability of the city and the neighborhoods. Big Box stores arent going to downtown, westvillage, masten, larkin or 1st Ward. However, Light Rail extensions can...when they do...these areas will benefit greatly

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Let me pray to Jesus that you're not an economic planner.

replied to paulsobo
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I read both articles by using the link provided in this one. The author in "Views of..." states that he is a recent graduate and that zeal is embedded within. That is a good thing.

The issue of being built to the curb is next to sacrosanct with urbanists and I do see the value. In his article, he makes a comparison to Kenmore and how the older business district is largely built to the sidewalk. But, I think it was more related to the times as the village was built before the overwhelming use of the automobile. I believe it incorporated in 1899 and access was by various forms of public transportation. It was a walking community in a time when people walked.

Stores built after the use of cars became more common placed parking lots in front. Malls became a new movement during the times when families became multiple vehicle households in the burbs. It's all a very simple history.

In places that are not densely populated urban areas (especially where public transportation is like it is in Buffalo), the car is a necessity. And they do take up considerable space and resources. It is far more than just a cultural construct even though Americans love the insulated world their cars provide.

The designs of Walmart suit Walmart. People will flock there no matter the design. When you consider that wages have stagnated at the level of 1973, the appeal is not difficult to understand nor is the impact on small retail businesses which is an entire story in itself.

I also have seen empty Walmart buildings that remain empty long after the Super Walmart replaces them. I think the assertion that they keep them vacant to avoid competition is largely true. There is certainly no shortage of resources in the company to afford such a strategy.

I sure would like to know the dynamics of the Walmart being built in Washington, D.C. that created the concept of one being built to the curb and as a mixed use site. But surely, the availability of land in the burbs has a great deal to do with the way Walmarts are built.

Market forces do apply! They do it because they can and it is a successful model. We can object all we like, but a change is unlikely.

If the current demographic trend to move back into cities becomes a real movement, we might then see new practices.

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The first generation of Walmarts were on greenfields in rural and suburban locations. The only thing I like about this recent bunch of Walmarts to go up is that they are redeveloping failed suburban retail sites. This means the infrastructure and traffic already existed, then were underused. Sheridan, Lockport Mall (yet to open) and Hamburg, replace large vacant retail plazas. The one in North Tonawanda replaced the closed Melody Fair site. I don't mind this as much. The former Walmarts might be a problem, but we'll see if they will be redeveloped. From what I've seen in other cities, if they are not they are usually maintained well enough so as to not be an eyesore.

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Good points. That Sheridan site had sat with a lot of vacancy for a long time. Also the new Walmart location there is accessible by Bailey bus route, so if city shoppers want to buy things that aren't too big for a bus that option now exists - whereas it didn't for the previous location farther out on NFB.

It's good that there's a wide variety of choices in WNY so that people who want to shop or work at stores like Walmart, Target, Wegmans, Tops, and so on can do so, while those who don't want to ever step foot into those have other options available.

If the flea market owner wants to continue that business, there's many possible sites for it - in the city or burbs.

replied to phrank
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Malwart...

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I wonder if public transportation will have/did have any affect on Walmart's decision. The Thruway Plaza location sits next to an NFTA bus hub that serves a large portion of the east side, West Seneca and even Lackawanna. It's actually quite convenient to get to if you rely on or prefer mass transit (with the exception of the somewhat long hike across the parking lot).

The SuperFlea site is only served by intermittent bus routes. It will be much harder to get to for folks without a car (and even for those who do drive, it will require an extra few minutes of driving along the most congested portion of Walden Ave, rather than the relatively easy easy access via the Thruway, Harlem, Walden and Broadway)

Also, the Thruway Plaza location sat right next to a large and fairly dense residential population. Further up Walden to the new site is primarily commercial with a few spatterings of very low-density residential areas. Not at ALL walkable, compared to the relatively pedestrian-friendly neighborhood within a half-mile of Thruway Plaza.

Also (and this is a BIG "IF"), the Thruway Plaza sat directly next to a potential light-rail line if the NFTA ever extended out to the airport.

With so much vacant land and potential at the Thruway Plaza site, it seems to me that the no-brainer would have been to demolish and rebuild -or simply expand- the existing location.

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re: a nefarious conspiracy to move the store further from the East Side patrons:

If those patrons are spending money, Walmart wants them, no doubt. The only question for the retailer is: where can sales be maximized? They needn't ask: what population segments need Walmart most? They might ask that, thinking that it will lead to better sales, but that's entirely their choice. To be responsible to their shareholders they only need ask: where can the most sales can be generated in this market?

Walmart has abundant experience and employs it dutifully as they crunch demographic data to determine where they need to be located.
Obviously, Walmart is confident the new location will more than make up for any lost sales from the abandoned location. Do you have any reason to doubt this? Do you see anything untoward in any of this? Where they choose to set up shop is up to them, isn't it? If not, why not?

replied to DeanerPPX
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Not at all. I see nothing nefarious in the decision at all.

Poor judgement, perhaps.

Ditching the stereotypically urban customer for the perceived wealthier suburban populace would make sense for any business that is trying to climb up in the marketplace (but Walmart is hardly that desperate, they thrive on cost-conscious and less-scrupulous shoppers, not the exurban dwellers who have the physical and economic means to drive an extra 5-10 miles to find the better bargains, more organic/local produce, and higher quality that other retailers offer)

In the spirit of this article, it truly IS a better deal for Buffalonians and urban dwellers, as it will force urban dwellers to pay a few extra pennies for better quality and more locally-friendly suppliers. At the same time, it will undercut the suburban and exurban big-box stores which already take the region's profits away from WNY (though replacing that commerce with a more streamlined money flow to Arkansas).

Walmart is all about perceived values and false economic growth. If an urban Trader Joes, Whole Foods, or even the existing Wegmanns market were to expand, Walmart would be a loser in their market share by this move.

They are playing a card that has worked well for them in Phoenix and Dallas, but simply isn't suitable for the WNY market. Dor a corporations that calculates every move, I wonder why they chose this course of action. It neither benefits themselves nor the community (not that they'd care about the community, but it's a change that hardly improves their market unless they plan on undercutting the local Wegmann's brand)

replied to biniszkiewicz
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If there is one thing this development does..its redefines the "ghetto" and its the nail in the coffin for the East Side. So ghetto that WalMart doesn't even want your money. I've been told the reason WalMart wanted to reopen further down Walden is that its got one of the highest "shrinkage" rates in the country. (Just incase you were wondering..shrinkage means stealing) This is about demographics..not wanting to be around people who steal from you and make it IMPOSSIBLE to conduct anything that looks like normal business. Its away from a bus line and further away from the City on purpose folks. Its the closest Walmart for everybody between Harlem Road to Downtown. What's that tell you?

I have a close friend that used to work at a different store in the Thruway plaza and the stories are out of this world..from the babies left in cars..to the Cheektowaga PD and the lower end clothing stores on a daily basis..to wally world customers pooping in the parking lot. Go to any of the other Walmarts..I swear to you they call this one "ghetto mart".

Its going to get harder for Cheektowaga..the disease spreads..Pine Hill..Sloan..Harlem Road..nobody in Cheektowaga is getting younger!!!

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What "Buffalo All Star" says is: Black People are moving into Cheektowaga, it will therefore become a "ghetto", and he considers them to be a "disease".

Demographics also say that 14201, 14213, and (more slowly) 14222 are going the same way. Good? Bad? Who knows; do you?

replied to Buffalo All Star
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Are you sure about Zip Code 14222? At one time, it had the highest percentage of college educated people approaching 50%h is highly exceptional. Depending on the region in Blue States, the average hovers in the low 20's. Considering that "blacks are moving into" is perjorative, let's just take it one step further and declare these new imports to 14222 as prosperous. Oh, how it takes me back to the Block Busting days!

replied to MrGreenJeans
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I'd agree. I live in a far eastern part of Cheektowaga and can be in Lancaster in a about a minute and I can tell you from first had experience that I've noticed more blacks in my neighborhood over the past 2-3 years. When I first moved in I never saw them, but now every time I see someone walking, their black. Which isn't either here, nor there, but interesting none the less.

replied to MrGreenJeans
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Weird..not at one time did I say anything about black people. It doesn't matter what color you are..black..white, brown..yellow whatever..the largest retail corporation in the world is MOVING FURTHER AWAY FROM ONE PART OF TOWN. Largely African American..sure, but not wholly.

"Ghettoization" as a disease is the spread of people (again people..I stress that..clearly this time) that can't seem to care about themselves, don't take care of their property, and cannot draw the line between whats acceptable between the hood and public. Citizens who do not take interest in bettering themselves..via education or building assets. Members of a community that is largly devoid of anyone in the middle/upper classes. (which is what we have here..concentrated poverty)An overall sympton of severe generational poverty in my opinion..something "black people" do in yours, understoood.

14222..thats some high living on section 8...little bit of a stretch there bud.

I am interested to see which suburb will be wny's first predominately African American suburb. This is inherently a good thing in my opinion (especially for the AA community), however if you take a ride around "North Cheektowaga" you'll notice quickly that its becoming wny's poorest suburb. (if its not already) The changes in the neighborhoods I listed above aren't exactly what one would call "community builders". Its not a trend that anyone wants to follow..."middle class moves in"..stays for 50 years..dies.."lower end renter" replaces middle class occupant. Not the receipe for success

replied to MrGreenJeans
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I can say that for my part of 14201 the last several houses to sell in my neighborhood have been to whites.

replied to MrGreenJeans
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As if a walmart was the biggest problem in the region. Unbelievable. Why don't these wannabe central planners address the reason why people shop there in the first place: convenience and affordability. If You want Walmart out of the picture, beat them: out-compete them and provide everything people want for less money. then you can play with little models of little streetscapes and hanging planters above the trolley entrance...so long as there's a place to park because the car is here to stay for good.

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I expect more from you Mike. When have you last shopped at the Galleria or at Boulevard Mall, or Eastern Hills or Home Depot or Lowes? Please stop imposing urban values on suburban development. People live in the suburbs because they want to and they want cars to take them everywhere and to park those cars somewhere. These are not city people and they do not want city type development. They want stores, lot's of 'em, and they want a place for their massive vehicles. As far as I am concerned any new development is an improvement especially the Flea Market. At least it will be landscaped and maintained and look reasonably fresh and new from the street. I don't see anybody getting upset when a new Wegmans (with a massive parking lot) is proposed. Nor do I see it when a new Home Depot is proposed. Only when WAL MART is proposed. Wal Mart has become the poster child for bad development and it's not fair.

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Exactly. Whole Foods comes in with their usual parking lot and it's all oohs and aahs. Walmart builds a store and everyone up in arms. Walmart, Target, Whole Foods, T.J.'s or Weggies, IT'S BOX WITH PARKING. Get over yourselves, stuck up snobs.

replied to DOC
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SO much hot air in here, open a window.

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Walmart is like casino gambling, a net loss to the host community. The "low" prices are due to the relentless assault on working people here and all around the world. Walmart is a ruthless corporation that profits from driving down wages and exploiting the poor in the developing world. The majority of their workers are paid below the poverty level and cannot afford health insurance resulting in the taxpayers footing the bill. These employees also qualify for food stamps, housing subsidies, and a host of other government programs. We in essence subsidize Walmart so they can avoid their responsibility to pay a fair and reasonable wage.
The pennies saved at Walmart are chump change as compared to the real cost of hosting this parasite corporation.

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You could say the same for entry level retail workers anywhere. Or do you really think that Kroger or Sears pays their clerks $100,000 a year?

replied to Black Rock Lifer
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South Park said it best...

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I'm a senior on fixed income and I shop Wal-Mart on Sheridan Drive, primarily for food. I save on cat food (no I don't eat it smart-alecs, my cat does), bake mixes, frozen foods and canned goods. Plus personal care products, printer paper and the occasional item from the garden center. I save several dollars on these items monthly, which helps my budget.

I have never seen a problem with the clientele, no cop cars in the parking lot.

I'm not a big fan of Wal Mart's union practices etc., but come on folks most retailers don't pay the help much.

As for the Super Flea site in Cheektowaga Wal Mart will be an improvement. Talk about uncleanliness, seaminess, and a high probability of fenced goods for sale along with a lot of junk.

There's a place in the retail world for both the big box places and the wonderful boutique-style shops of the Elmwood Strip and elsewhere. They represent different modes of shopping: utilitarian and need vs. specialized and the "I'd like to have that."

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I think the pictures are contradicting your point. The Delaware Ave Plaza is loaded with cars and people while the Delaware streetscape is desolate and devoid of activity.

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Good catch. Although sometimes that to-the-sidewalk block in Kenmore looks less inactive than when that pic was taken, I'd bet businesses near there don't get nearly as much customer flow as the plaza with front parking lot does (like for T-Mobile, Subway, Starbucks, game store, etc) shown in other pic.

Regarding Mike's article's suggestion that its parking lot should be in back instead of front, I'd guess that way would reduce impulse customers who while driving by decide to stop, browse for phones or games, or grab coffee or sandwich. Having easy parking be visible is a big plus for those.
Yeah, stores like Starbucks in EV and Subway on Hertel don't have front parking lots, but they at least have onstreet parking (which Delaware doesn't in that block, maybe part of why front parking lot was built).

replied to Linksfiend
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Is this the Delaware Road in Kenmore thats got the huge surface parking lots right behind its solid "walkable Main Street"?..looks it to me!

replied to Linksfiend
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What Elaine wrote makes very good sense.

Basically the article's headline and main premise is mistaken - the new Walmart really isn't a negative for the region or for Cheektowaga. If anything it's a small net positive for both.

And who knows, maybe even the flea market will reopen somewhere in the region anyway. If it does in Buffalo, that would be a small positive here for people who like it or who benefit from its customers. Or if it doesn't, then the whole thing really has no impact on Buffalo - except maybe as a plus for any city residents who want to shop or work at the new upgraded Walmart in Cheektowaga.

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It's good this isn't in the city proper, but still, I don't see how this is really good for anybody. Dislike Wal-Mart!

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I am reading things like "wrong kind of development and we are going to become like every other city out there." Really? You mean the same cities that people from here are moving to. Wrong kind of development? So a dirty, dimly lit superflea that sells junk is a better alternative? I am for development, I wish some of you would get your head out of your a$$ and stop fighting potential jobs coming to the area.. Don't just consider the sales rep jobs that come from this, but all of the other jobs involved in constructing one of these. Sorry, but "Toothless Joe's Bong Emporium" isn't eactly the right kind of development either.

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I would never set foot into a Wal Mart. But if people are naive enough to believe their "always low prices" propaganda, than that is on them. I detest auto centric development but until America learns to run efficient, convenient public transportation and changes its transportation funding priorities, most people are going to continue to favor cars over stop and go buses. Most developers are going to be compelled into developing a property that is auto centric instead of pedestrian friendly because it is all dollars and cents.

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