Karl Rove speaks at Canisius College
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Leave a commentYeah, GW kept us safe. Does he not know that 9/11 happened on his watch??? And what about secret prisons, never charging detainees, torture, the outing of a CIA agent, lying to lead the United States into an unnecessary war, and a secret illegal wiretapping of his fellow American citizens. He should be in prison for life, not on the public speaking circuit. Shame on Canisius for bringing in such a sinner.
shame, indeed. the man is scum.
I sure hope we can look forward to seeing more of good-ol' Karl (aka "turd blossom") around town, as he is investing in Buffalo real estate via Sinatra. At Spot? Five Points? (Speaking of which, why does it appear he just ate Five Points, like the entire store?)
Karl is one evil, evil dude.
Scum? Really?
When David Axelrod comes to Buffalo, I may disagree with almost every word I've ever heard him utter, but I wouldn't call him scum, just misguided.
Thanks to BR for reporting this without injecting the sophmoric liberal spin that readers here seem to lap up.
any man who advocates for torture is scum. I loathe his political views. I loathe his partisan hypocrisy (so deftly exposed, on numerous occasions, by the writers at the Daily Show). But in his advocacy for war, extraordinary renditions, foreign prisons and particularly for torture, he descends (my opinion) to nothing less than scum.
I did not attend. I did not want to be in the same room as this dude. In my opinion, the partisan divide in Washington is the biggiest problem we face as a nation. Being an idependent, I don't advocate for either party because I agree and disagree with both on different issues. It maddens me to listen to people like Karl Rove who have no remote sense of compromise and mindlessley tow their party line without any objective viewpoint what-so-ever. Karl Rove is the personification of partisan politics bull$h@t.
Compromise is difficult to reach when the two sides have a fundamental difference on the role of government. If your wife say's I'd like to spend $200 on a pair of shoes, and your position is we don't have the money to spend... well, good luck on the compromise.
I think your analogy is an oversimplification.
You're basing your view on the writings of a comedy show? I should probably stop at that. What's next, a discussion on science based on The Jetson's?
Torture is a car battery hooked to your testicles, or a needle in the open eye (which in the immediate aftermath of 9-11 I'd have thought justified...I'll accept your label of scum, but better that than more innocent people dying), not a bucket of water to the face.
No one advocated war until after planes were flown into our buildings. Perhaps you think that was planned by us? Would the proper response to Pearl Harbor have been a strongly worded letter?
I'll accept you don't like the guy, or republicans in general. Odd though that in non-political matters, you seem quite even keeled.
"Not a bucket of water to the face", wow, you think waterboarding is that simple? Waterboarding is forcing large quanities of water into your nose and mouth until you almost drown. We are still waiting for Sean Hannity to make good on his pledge to be waterboarded but we aren't holding our breath waiting. Torture demeans our country, demeans those that take part, and forces us to surrender the high ground we claim to hold as Americans. Bini is right on, Karl is scum and any reasonable Republican knows that.
Let me choose....water in the nose, or slowly burned to death on the 105th floor where I went to work everyday. Not really a choice, is it?
We can't control crazy fanatics from doing horrible things but we should be able to control our own government from stooping to the same level.
Good to know you're still around, hadn't heard from you in a bit. Thought Mr. Rove might bring you out.
You and I agree on the city, preservation, work ethic, and other areas but boy do we differ on politics, that is a good thing in that our country needs to explore different ideas.
And i gather your point is that waterboarding is not really torture, but it makes for a good revenge fantasy.
If your point is that we need torture to get information out of people, the evidence is quite thin. In fact, most people will say anything to get you to stop torture. It's why the Nazis discarded torture. You don't get good infomration.
If, however, your point is merely to inflict pain upon other people, which I believe is your main point, then sure, torture accomplishes that goal quite admirably.
And i gather your point is that waterboarding is not really torture, but it makes for a good revenge fantasy.
If your point is that we need torture to get information out of people, the evidence is quite thin. In fact, most people will say anything to get you to stop torture. It's why the Nazis discarded torture. You don't get good infomration.
If, however, your point is merely to inflict pain upon other people, which I believe is your main point, then sure, torture accomplishes that goal quite admirably.
as to the 'writers of the comedy show', let me expand: what they would do is simply show videotape of Rove saying one thing when it applied to Republicans and then saying exactly the opposite whenever it applied to Democrats. The writers didn't 'write' a thing at all. Maybe I should have said 'producers', or 'Jon Stuart'. All they did was play tapes of Rove being Rove, back to back so the hypocrisy was fully displayed. Those segments were hilarious, because they showed him to be a completely unprincipled scurrilous partisan.
For example, at one point a Democratic VP contender was the former mayor of a Carolina city, I believe, of 200,000 people who'd recently become governor. Rove excoriated the possibility of this person ascending to the presidency as patently ridiculous. A small town mayor such as this, with scant gubernatorial experience of a second tier state, Rove went on and on, just showed the bankruptcy and naivete of Democrats in even considering such an obvious lightweight for the most important political position in the world. Someone on this minor scale, Rover assured viewers, could not possibly be presidential material, at least not for the foreseeable future.
Then, only a few months later McCain selected Palin. And Rove extolled to the heavens her qualifications for the presidency, stressing her outstanding experience in the trenches as mayor of Wasilla (population 8,000) and how that extraordinary experience as well as her year on the job as governor of a small population state more than fully qualified her to step immediately into the president's shoes if the need arose.
The 'writers' didn't write a damn thing. All they did was show Rove saying one thing with respect to Democrats, and then showing that back to back with him a few months later saying precisely the opposite with respect to Republicans. It was far from the only example of theirs. He is shameless. Positively, despicably shameless in his partisanship and that is why he is so wretchedly disgusting, even sans the torture and misguided paranoia. He has zero scruples. He is party-first, right or wrong, country-first, right or wrong, despicable bigot.
Unprincipled partisanship is simply wrong. Period. If you have principles and fight for them, that's one thing. Ron Paul is a nut case. But he's sincere and consistent. No dishonor to that. Rick Perry stands for lots of stuff at the opposite end of the political spectrum from me, but he believes what he says. I can live with that. Time and again the Daily Show demonstrated that Rove simply did not believe what he said (Gingrich is another unscrupulous such partisan). Rove only said what he thought would be convincing to his partisans, not what he believed to be the truth. He is not a truth teller. He is a manipulator of truth. Add to that his horrid judgment (hello Iraq invasion) and you find the level of antipathy evidenced here in this blog in response.
The democrat was Tim Kaine of Virginia. With all due respect, if they found Rove saying anything overly positive about Palin...well, it hasn't happened too often. He was one of the stronger voices during this current election cycle saying that she wasn't qualified.
Karl Rove is a bit like Pat Kaletta for the Sabres. If he's on your team you love him, if he's not, you hate him.
For every Rove on the right, there's a Carville on the left. They both achieved notoriety for being able to see through the polling data, and get their candidate elected. Your car's broke, you go to a mechanic, you want to win an election, you see one of these guys. Hoping they have some statesman like quality is wishing for too much.
You're rigth: it was Kaine. I find Carville's wife equally partisan to Carville, but neither offend me. I don't agree with her, but she doesn't roil my blood like Rove does. Good for him for speaking out about Palin.
And part of my antipathy toward Rove is misplaced: I have an odd quirk sometimes, where I meld two people in my head even though they're very different. With Rove I sometimes do this with Cheney. As I was writing about Rove, some of my thoughts drifted to Cheney. No excuse for it . . . Same thing happens when I listen to Paula Poundstone on Wait Wait Don't Tell Me. I hear Paula Poundstone, but half the time I picture Rosie O'Donnell. Don't know why.
Actually we didn't invade Iraq because of 9/11. We eventually went into Afghanistan because of 9/11 because they were harboring Al Qaeda. The rational for invading Iraq was that Saddam was producing yellow cake uranium for nuclear weapons. Remember the 6 year search for WMD's. Do you remember Valerie Plame the CIA operative who was outed by Dick Cheney because her husband, ambassador Joe Wilson contradicted the administration. He identified the document which was being used to support the claim that Saddam possessed yellow cake as fraudulent?
Democrats in the senate voted 29 to 21 to go to war with Iraq. 9/11 changed everything. If the chance were 1 in a 100 that Iraq could have developed a dirty bomb that might have fallen into terrorist hands, the decision had to be made.
So in the end we removed Saddam Hussein who was actually the only counter balance to Iranian dominance in the mideast. IMO not a smart strategy. Plus your contention that 9/11/01 'changed everything' doesn't explain why we did not invade Iraq until march 2003. Congress was well aware that Saddam did not tolerate Al Qaeda on his soil, but in the end were swayed by now discredited Intelligence reports.
WAterboarding has been deemed torture by all intenrational organizations, and they did so long before W ever approved of it. Indeed, Phylis Shafley expressly stated that waterboarding is torture -- at least when communists did it against catholic clergy.
However, if you believe it isn't torture, we welcome you to under go it to prove your point.
Waterboarding was deemed torture by the USA and was one of the main successful prosecutions for WAR CRIMES by the Nazi's and Japanese - until the WAR CRIMINALS of the bush* regime re-embrased it as policy.
My father and uncles fought a war to stop scum like Rove and bush*.
* selected - never elected.
Riiiight - the comparison to Pearl Harbor would be apt if the proper response to Pearl Harbor was to invade Mexico.
Again - for you dummiesj - THERE WERE NOW WMD IN IRAQ!
And bush didn't keep us "safe" - WTC happend on HIS watch in spite of all the EXPLICIT WARNINGS to the contrary!!!
And we are stil paying dearly for his WAR CRIMES!!!
This man is the face of all that is wrong in America today. He is a ruthless partisan with no decency or honesty. He mastered the art of distorting the truth and repeating lies until the low information voters were convinced they were facts. He represents the greed, arrogance, and elitism that has become the face of the modern Republican Party. He is in no way a statesman or even a credible political advocate, why would Canisious give him a forum?
Funny that I can agree with most of your description, but come to a different conclusion. If your side didn't have such a negative view of greed, we'd have an unemployment rate well below where it is. Work is good after all, isn't it?
Work is good, I have been working for over 40 years. I was fortunate to have been raised with values that celebrated a comfortable but modest lifestyle, not caught up in the false chase of materialism and greed.
This guy is a huge sack of nuts.
Anyone who likes this guy should read Dick Clarke's "Against All Enemies" and then tell me how much you like him.
And on Clarke's book and Rove's safety comment. If indeed W. kept America safe then Rove was certainly swimming against that current.
"If you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes the truth"
- Joseph Goebbels (Adolf Hitler's Nazi Propaganda Minister)
Why ius this WAR CRIMINAL still not in Prison?!!!
WHy woiuld snyone waste time on what that evil creature has to say...
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Rove is famous for his double speak.
Coined words like: "Patriot Act", "Clean Air Act", "No Child Left Behind", "Fair & Balanced" all the exact opposite of what they portend.
Obama was a "Racist" and at the same time he was a country club "Elitist".
"Entitlement" is the scurge of moochers, while banks too big to fail, ExxonMobile can't get enough tax breaks and Congressmen are set for life, after just one term.
And my favorite: "George W. Bush kept us safe".
The only way to have made this speech better was to name it "Liberals Are A Bunch of Fools."
Aptly named after the city he was in, being filled to the brim with foolish liberals.
Somebody buy BBTie a bus ticket to Alabama, so you can lick your wounds with your brethren 47 days from now.