Legislation Aims to Strengthen Craft Brewing Industry
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Leave a commentMy guess is Jesse has never worked in the small business environment, or any business, in New York State. Hey, I was right! Thumbs down for me.
Nice try, but you're wrong. I just have principles.
How sad it is that your favorite industry has to kneel before the gods in Albany and pray that they are graced with special favors in order to make their businesses profitable.
Wouldn't it better to clean the shit up and make ALL business easier to do in NYS?
Remember, what one group of politicians gives away, another group can take.
I'm probably not actually wrong, but I agree with your statements whole-heartily.
But after digesting them I need to ask myself the question: what are the chances. After a quick query, the results demonstrate an extremely low likelihood. So while I agree with you, I am also a realist.
What about New Era Caps? They got income tax credits through the Empire Zone program, aid and assistance from other New York agencies, including energy efficiency financing from the New York State Energy Research and Development Authority and aid in the selection and training of its employees from the New York State Department of Labor. Additionally, the Erie County Industrial Development Agency, working together with the Town of Evans and the Lake Shore Central School District, offered property tax relief via a payment-in-lieu-of taxes (PILOT) agreement and various sales tax abatements. National Grid has also provided generous assistance for investment in electrical infrastructure and equipment through its own grant programs.
That took a minute to find from when New Era was going to close the Derby plant. Don't make it sound like only one industry gets breaks. Ford, GE, Geico, companies get incentives to come and incentives to stay. It's just another form of corporate greed.
And the vicious cycle continues until the only companies that get to work in NYS are those with connections to those in power.
Great system you have here, man. Let's just cheer it on when it's a group we like, and cry when it's some group we don't (frackers).
Sorry you think I made it sound like only one industry gets breaks - that'd be a ridiculous statement to make, good thing I didn't.
Come on, YesSir, tell us all what "small business environment" you've worked in!
Obviously you are correct. People on this site think from a big government point of view. They ask questions like ...'what could my elected representative do for that group...'.
Small business people, and real job creation, doesn't happen that way. An individual loves something, they do it, and become profitable and grow. They don't have the time or interest to get into what barriers the government may be willing to lower just for them.
Jesse's point is that if you really want to help small business (and grow real jobs), reduce the size of government across the board. A hundred years ago that would have been common sense, today it's considered radical tea party rhetoric. Keep up the good fight Jesse.
This constant drumbeat of "government is the problem" is naive and lacks real evidence. Government enables business, we as taxpayers provide the infrastructure for business to build upon and grow. There would be very little opportunity without the transportation network, police and fire protection, communications network, and the mulitude of other services provided by government (or taxpayers). With those entitlements comes an obligation to pay taxes and respect the rules and regulations put into place by our elected representatives. Those rules and regulations protect business in many ways and protect the rest of us from the excess's of business. The free market system works well but regulation is necessary as greed is a powerful force.
I am not saying NYS is perfect, there is plenty of room for reform but this Tea Party rhetoric of attacking government is not only simplistic but is an affront to the principles on which this country was founded.
'the excesses of business'...like donations to churches, sponsoring Ride for Roswell, donating food to the food shelter, supporting the Philharmonic, donating to Women's and Children's Hospital, sponsoring Little League teams... yeah, the excesses of business will be the downfall of us all. In business, nothing happens until you sell something. Then you create jobs, pay taxes, and if you're very fortunate, the business spins off profit that can go for the greater good.
I was refering more to polluting our air and water, ripping off investors, cheating customers, reneging on debts, etc. Those costs are born by all of us, sponsoring the Ride for Roswell and the like in no way offsets these huge burdens on society.
I should clarify, these abuses are not the case with most business and certainly not with small business but regulation is necessary to keep em honest.
I think there about as many 'greedy' people on the right, as there are 'lazy' people on the left... no where near as many as those on the opposite side of the argument would tend to believe. I've never experienced polluting, investor ripoffs, cheating customers, or reneging on debts with any small business I've been a part of.
See my clarification above, I think we are in agreement on small business. Some examples of bigger business would be Tonawanda Coke poisoning our air, Jim Kelly stiffing his creditors after his nightclub failed, and of course Wall St and the big banks, too big to fail and too long a story to tell here.
That could be the first comment from you that I've ever given a thumbs up too, well said.
Good to find common ground, I think we all have good intentions regardless of our differences.
Hey blackrock, when you talk about stuff like: "the transportation network, police and fire protection, communications network," you ain't gonna get much argument from anyone with a brain.
But even you have to admit, government's gone a TEENSY bit beyond that.
Just so we're clear, the idea that an individual should be able to start a business without looking for a handout, is a radical tea party concept?
The infrastructure argument is increasingly less relevant. An extreme example would be the 'Rochester bus driver'. Think about the 'infrastructure' she used in getting almost a million dollars ( I haven't looked lately). The government will take how much of that ... $400,000?. I realize Al Gore invented it, so government should get it's take, but somehow thinking that the private sector needs the governments help is foolish.
The argument should begin and end with Solyndra. Let investors invest, let the government do as little as possible.
The private sector could not exist without government, see Somalia or Afghanistan for example. My point is that all of us are in this together, with rights and responsibilities. Attacking the very instituition that was put in place by the founding fathers is not patriotic or constructive.
Why does the Tea Party hate our government and in turn hate the will of the American people? Could it be they simply have a very narrow view of America and are not comfortable with the democratic process? The Tea Party had their day, they could not articulate any real vision or offer any alternatives, being against government and taxes is not a credible philosophy. They have no appeal beyond old white curmudgeons and will be a minor footnote in our history.
Blackrock, sounds like your preaching from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs. The democratic process is not what the founding fathers established in the slightest; they established a republic to avoid the tyranny of the masses as much as the tyranny of the elite. Over the last 200 hundreds years the masses have become a tool for the left elite to crush the right other. The left has just been much more effective at leveraging the masses up to this point. Being able to tell a group 'we'll take form them and give to you' is generally a winning strategy. The thing I find so shocking about it is we have nearly 100 years of evidence to show socialism doesn't work without an outside score of revenue to make up for the loss of productivity. Be that natural gas like the Scandinavian countries, or just American tourism, banking and import dollars for the continental countries. Greece is a very clear micro example of this again. Somehow the idea that American will find someone richer then ourselves to fund socialism it is perplexing.
But back to beer, something most on the right, left, and center can agree on. I support the local brewers, they should have some kind of advantage, it makes economic sense to encourage local small business, we all benefit from their efforts. (and craft beer is just better)
To paraphrase a great American:
To Beer: the cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.
Little know fact: Cider was legal during prohibition.
String together a couple of great breweries and you will get beer tourists. I have a couple of friends that go with Michigan just to taste at breweries. What other reason could you have to go to Kalamazoo...
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So basically, it's a tax giveaway to beer producers in NYS. Preferential treatment for one industry or another - it's the American way!
Breweries already pay a ridiculous amount of money in start up fees, taxes and distribution fees. This was an unnecessary tax to begin with and rescinding it was the right thing to do. Craft brewing is an industry that is actually GROWING in NYS as opposed to all the other industries who are fleeing for cheaper areas to produce goods. Kudos to the State for doing the right thing for once.
Hey, if they giveaway stuff to other businesses, maybe they'll stick around too!
What is it about specific industries that get politicians all in a lather about hurrying up to give 'em tax breaks?
The point: Give ALL businesses a break. Make it easy to create ANY business in NY. Then maybe they wouldn't be in such a hurry to leave.
Don't waste my time giving away particulars to one special interest or another. Or is brewing somehow not a "special interest" to you guys?
As an aside, why the hell does it have to take an act of our illustrious legislature(s) to "allow them to sell NYS-labeled beer and cider for consumption on and off the premises, and at state fairs, county fairs and farmers markets."
Just get the hell out of the way, NYS. Keep Food Legal. http://www.keepfoodlegal.org/
State and local governments are always giving breaks to big businesses. How much money is given to the Bills? How much were they going to give to Bass Pro to come here? And you always hear about tax incentives and utility breaks being given to a company to move here or stay here. It is all about getting breaks. Small breweries producing less than 60,000 barrels is at least giving a break to some little guys and possibly allowing some farms to survive by producing other crops.
I feel like I wasn't clear so I'll state this a different way. My point was that breweries face fees that many other businesses don't. The original idea was to lower the cost of brewing for in state brewers in an attempt to jump start craft brewing in NY. This doesn't give them an upper hand on other NY businesses just out of State breweries. It worked as the craft brew scene in NY is great both downstate and upstate.
Then a MA distributor (Shelton Brothers fuck them)challenged the law so the higher tax was imposed on NY brewers as well.
The new tax and fee relief puts NY breweries back at competitive advantage over out of State breweries but doesn't really make it any cheaper as far as the overall shitiness of doing business in NYS.
Uh... the silliness here is breathtaking.
Brewers face more regulations and fees so let's give them some specific regulations and fees that reduce their original regulations and fees.
So the answer to too much regulation is more regulation?
NYS should be a leader in craft beer. I'll take something that's going to encourage its growth.
"Of the 1,759 breweries in America, only 43 are not defined as craft brewers"
Craft beer sales in 2010 were $7.6 billion, a $600 million dollar increase in ONE YEAR.
I'll hop in this pool, especially for such an unfriendly business state.
I'll hop in this pool
It's the yeast they could do.
Nice. Yeah I didn't realize my pun until after I posted.