Plans for Aud Site, Canals and Market Hall Refined

Perfect. No more changes!

Let's start building!

Word up...lets get shovels in the ground!

I have to say, I like the renderings very much. No big box=good. But I am a bit confused on the canals: One rendering shows boats floating down the canal. However, the cross section of the canal shows pedestrians walking on water that is about 12" deep (perhaps because of that damned Hamburg drain). Are we still dealing with the fake canals with super shallow water that no boat can navigate? If so, it will look cheesy.

YES! YES! AND YES! Let's get this going!!!

It certainly looks like the Spaulding Mercantile is very close to being reconstructed.

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE the plans for these buildings without BassPro it actually looks like an urban, walkable mixed use waterfront that is not fixed on one anchor tenant but is flexible enough to change decade to decade. It will allow retail to convert to office space...and vice versa. It will allow office space to convert to residential and vice versa..

Bass Pro would have become a Main Place Mall dead zone with Bass Pro...this is much better

Vast improvement-very exciting. However, I was in Baltimore this past weekend, where I paid a visit to the Inner Harbor; despite the fact that I think the area is potentially now OVERbuilt, they have done a great job of infusing modern structures (all glass, etc.) into the mix. I don't think we should be afraid to do that as well.

TAKE DOWN THE SKYWAY!!!!

Less talk, more rock

best rendering i've seen of this project

LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!
Even the Shallow Cannel, we can Ice Skate in the winter and do the Gondola in summer or just play in the water, how user friendly can we be! The Shoppes and Office and Residential is wonderful we can live there and shoppe there, so is self sustainable even if no new folks come which they will. It can support it self as a community best idea yet, keep it going!

;---} LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT!!!!!!!

"The site would be anchored by a 150-room hotel"

You fickle fickle Romans you.

Can't wait to stay in the hotel and walk to dinner someday.

Thumbs up.

PLEASE...build it NOW!
The historical building renditions are great. The buildings look so much better than that Museum building that is down there now. If at all possible please make the canals deep and bridges high enough for small barge replicas that can be used as water taxis from one end to the other,also as BuffaloHead said construct the buildings to be as versatile as possible to quickly make use of trends and needs as the area develops and grows.
Looking good

There was talk of turning the HSBC Atrium into a 150 room hotel a few years ago. Is someone tipping their hand on the future of HSBC downtown?

Love it. Please build this plan and put the doubters to rest!

EXCELLENT!!!! LET'S GET MOVING!!!

WOW -everyone is agreeing on this!
Transpo guy said it very nicely - less talk, more rock!

I'll agree that shallow canals are a bit cheesy, but at the same time, wonder how many private boats would actually want to navigate the canals unless there are places for them to tie off. In effect, the canal reconstructions might turn into a maritime version of a dead-end street with no curb-side parking.

Just a thought, would it be any better to keep the canals roped off from the river and solely used by gondolas and rentable paddle boats and the like? (like the little 1- or 2-person pedal-power boats you used to be able to rent on Hoyt Lake or Darien Lake... would that be equally as cheesy??)

Either way, these plans and renderings are FAR superior to anything we've seen so far. I just hope that there is an interested hotel chain lined who will respect the integrity of the project. Otherwise, we'll have to go through another Bass Pro scenario trying to lure a big name hotel and ending by giving away a million quality concessions, only to end up with a drab Motel 6 or something.

It's fine, let's run with it. Just build it before someone decides to file a lawsuit.

Wow, this is by far the best so far! Even the shallow canal isn't bad, if some day we have the money to dig it out, so be it. Move forward with this one now!

On first pass, looks like some great work here!

Especially nice to see the transit station reappear in Canalside plans -- after a, what, 5-year absence! The decision last year not to use the Aud site for Bass Pro -- and the apparent decision now not to use the site for a significant parking garage -- reopened the door for the transit station. Yet the flaw is that the transit station, as shown here, is not adjacent to Main Street -- so it's not apparent how it could serve the important intermodal/multimodal role of linking passenger rail (Amtrak, which runs under the lower terrace), MetroRail on Main Street, Bus, as well as auto parking (looks like some shown underground) and bike parking.

Yes, bike parking: this project would be a great opportunity to create a bike parking facility. Look at the world-class bike parking facility in Millennium Park in Chicago -- designed by Buffalo Rising's own Steel. We in Buffalo deserve nice things, too!

ECHDC & City, let's make sure the transit center is properly located and well-designed. And includes a bike parking facility. We know a guy who could design that for you!

Looks great!

although i wonder why the extra wide bridge get chopped off at pearl street. Is it necessary to have such a wide bridge here when it doesn't fit? Also it would be nice to terminate the long view across the canals from Main Street with some type of pavilion or small retail structure at the point the wide bridge lands to the right in perspective view. Maybe a good place for an iconic modern peice of public architecture...mix it up some.

But overall looks like it is coming along quite well!

Doesn't it look like the "Transit Center" is actually an entrance to an underground platform for the Amtrak rails under Lower Terrace? You can see it more clearly on the "Canal Level" slide 7 and Transit Center slide 21 of http://www.scribd.com/doc/52858351/EEK-Public-Canal-plan-for-the-Inner-Harbor

Approximately 5 years ago a group (of about 20 including myself) tried to start a FINE ARTS and ANTIQUES Market in the old DL&W train station. Unfortunately, the DL&W representative involved with the project retired and the project efforts ended after that.
I would love to see such a project intiated again - perhaps in the Public Market? The group that met in the past was very diverse and included representatives from high end resturants, fine antiques businesses, professional street entertainers,a Canal ship/sailboat rental company,high end bakery and more-- etc.
I think this type of project would be great for the canal.
I could see it in the public market.

This is awesome. I hope this place looks like this in 5 years.

SCORE!

(Please start now...)

ok start asap. no more talk please. What is Bendersons timeline for the actual buildings in this development? Any tenants lined up here? Are these mixed to include residential above as well or all commercial, retail, hotel? It would be great to see the whole thing under construction for the National Trust National Conference this coming fall.

I don't think I have ever read an article in this blog in which there have been so many positive sentiments lumped together. And, unlike my other comments, I have to agree -- this is awesome. There's finally a plan in place that doesn't corporate greed and whorish appeal. Let's start building and get the plan in motion. Awesome job Buffalo. Awesome.

Great idea with the public market. But do we need more living space in Buffalo but like I always gripe about, can we leave out the hotels? With so many boutique hotels within a mile of the site, why not encourage visitors to come further into the city?

ready, set.... GO!

One question, how are boats supposed to access the inner canals, and what is the Hamburg drain?

Great plan let's make it happen ASAP!!!!

Now that there is a quality design concept and we have, in essence, started over (or, hit refresh), let's put out an RFP so that Buffalo can chose from quality developers (from Buffalo and afar). Why is Benderson, who has never developed anything of any quality, or so I have seen, get to be grandfathered in?

anyone know the status/plan for the Donovan Building?

And to think for ten years officials were begging Bass Pro to build here. After a few years it would have been just another yawner big-box retail store.

the plans look great but what's this place going to be like in the winter?...for the three months of nice weather this place will be a major draw....and maybe that will be enough to make it worth it.... I just can't ever imagine coming down here in January

OK, GO!

oh and also.... at least this isn't as insane as the plans they have to build those 2k/month loft apartments in North Tonawanda by the canal...."gate way to the western frontier" so they say....who in their right mind would do something like that?

For some reason I get the feeling that Benderson canned the Maple Road project near UB North in favor of focusing their efforts on tenants for this. The City wins for the first time against the burbs? Pittsburgh has SouthSide Works. This is above and beyond that with renderings that actually draw you in and actually resemble the original atmosphere and dense activity that once existed here. I really hope they start making announcements of some tenants by summer time. CANADA is here and they want to shoppe! Relocating Amtrak directly to the MetroRail and extending it as shown on the slides to this area seems like it would be a great improvement. I've been in that station several times and it was definitely overcrowded, it could use an expansion.

i would visit this place once a week. jeesh.

I approve wholeheartedly!

I notice there will be Canal level and Street level retail.

I would love to see a Canal level Brewery. Pretty please make it so.

I love this. It's a great plan, and I hope it's put into action asap. If this happens ::warning, I'm getting ahead of myself:: I beg of the developers (or who ever is in charge of these things), please make sure quality design standards and products are used. Those small details are oh-so-important and make the difference between an area feeling cold and unsafe, vs. one that feels welcoming, comfortable, special - and more importantly - worth leaving the suburbs to visit. Use beautiful cobblestone, rich woods, ornate and authentic street lamps...

And yes, this needs to have appeal throughout the year, not just warm weather months or businesses will fail. Heated sidewalks, giant outdoor fireplaces (that act as flower beds during the summer?), ice skating, an Ice Bar to keep people entertained and interested, heat lamps under all retail awnings, hearty winter trees....

I just read a comment from another thread. Light the Skyway!

And, thank you to the Obstructionists who...hmmm...encouraged the Powers That Be to go back to the drawing board (and, props to the PTB for doing so).....

The major problem STILL remains (though I love the designs and building renderings). The Hamburg drain is preventing this from becoming a TRUE Erie Canal recreation. We should be able to treat it like the central wharf currently is - with boats being in and around it. This is a re-creation that is not common in major cities in the US. Having the ability to drive, park a boat and get out to go shop, get a meal, etc is what can define this. It is instantly able to bring in Canadians who have a stronger dollar to shop, eat, drink etc. I'm not sure the DOHS status on that would be though....

bottom line - things are looking up but having a 12inch fake canal is typical Buffalo. It's just like stopping the Metro at UB South. We ALL know the Hamburg drain will need to be moved some day. Suck it up, spend the money, and do it RIGHT THE FIRST TIME.

and thats why I rarely post from out here in Japan...

Woah...much closer! Way to sharpen those pencils! It does need to be tweeked...The canal seems too Disney for Buffalo. It is what it is. Make it a concrete pad that has the ability to be turned into a ice skating rink in the winter. In the summer, it will just be stinky and stagnant. That one bridge seems in the foreground seems to be overkill. Bu cool! How about the parking ramp? how does that integrate? and the Donavan building? and what do these building look like on approach? are they just facades facing the canal?

Shovels. To. The. Dirt. NOW.

I havent seen this many comments so quickly for any other post, it all looks great...The idea for a hotel near the arena is perfect...These are the things that should of been done before the NCAA's came to town, both hockey and basketball...World Juniors etc.....I know things take time but the positive image of that area would of been spread around so quickly if everything was in motion earlier...We have the idea, the money is there somewhat..environmental impacts have been done, presesrvationists have given their word...What else needs to be done? Cant we get this started now? We have had years to talk to commercial and retail outsiders, so they should already know about the concept for the most part....Build it and they will come.....And if they dont, what a cool ghost town setting on the waterfront it would be......

I have to admit, I too am a little confused about the transit center's location.

I wonder if I really dont understand its purpose. Is it actually a "welcome center" that tourist buses pull up to, or is it intended to be a true multi-model transportation center?

As the first, it could work. As a true terminal, eeeeeeeeeek!

Hey Brian Higgins... since the NYSDOT magically swayed your decisions on removing the skyway, how about petitioning them to do something creative with the bridge? Perhaps adding a non-functional bridge truss/arch, soften the pillars, or light the beast up? There seems to be quite a bit of money left over from the Bass Pro incentives to make this happen.

That aside, looooooove how this is shaping up!

WOW!
I got that Christmas morning feeling in my stomach when I saw this.
This is AWESOME!
A real Public Market... Love it!

This has to get done.

Ice skating on the canals... :)

Awesome. Great. Just do something before I'm too old to enjoy it.

I just don't see the point of funneling bus traffic down there. IMO, that eats up a lot of real estate that can be put to far better use, and introduces more noxious fumes to an area that just doesn't need it. If it's really that much of a concern, the NFTA could just run a shuttle between the canal transit center and the existing station. Or better yet, just take the train to Church & walk 2 blocks.

WOW! Not a negative comment in the crowd.... Call this a holiday for BUFFALO Wooot Wooot! As one of the final three teams interviewed for the canal wall side of the project, we were disappointed to not be selected, but we are proud Buffalonians and are thrilled the project is moving forward!

I say it again: RFP for new developers to come to the table!!!

BUILD IT!!!!!!!!! YES!!

I'm not thrilled by what this says about our appreciation for history and architecture. It is a perfect snapshot of today's urban planning cliches. Still I hope it gets built. It will be nice to see some follow through and to finally see a culture develop around the waterfront. Today many (especially those who comment on Buffalo Rising) disapprove of what was the prevailing low-brow design aesthetic of late 70s early 80s urban renewal projects and shopping malls. I suspect that this waterfront design will have a similar shelf-life. This is the prevailing low-brow aesthetic for the 2000s.

Quick suggestion: if the WNY rail museum is operating heritage streetcars, incorporating them into the streetscape would provide additional ways to access the area as well as ambiance.

To make this place a real draw the canals have to be accessible by boat. Connect the commercial slip with these and we would really have something special.

Very cool!

Rendering looks great, the scale and density is perfect for the site. So much better than the Bass Pro proposal. Agree with the need for the canals to be navigable and connected to the allow access to the waterfront.

Why are there only white people in the drawings?

That wasn't funny at all.

Is the money already in place for the market? Is the hotel simply an idea?

Here's some cool news about the new water taxi coming to the harbor this summer. If it was able to make it to this proposed site it would be even better.

http://www.buffalonews.com/city/communities/buffalo/article391550.ece

I keep having this dream of a Ricky Gervais style BRO cartoon show where Steel is Ricky, ILuvPitbulls is Stephan Merchant, and Assaroni is Karl Pilkington. It would be a riot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6foP5QiFTVA&feature=related

I think it looks great.

If it were up to me though I'd use the money they are spending on canals to fix the issue of raw sewage spilling into the lake during heavy rains. Get the crap out of the water before digging replica canals.

It kinda seems a little silly to come this far and settle for a canal 12 inches deep?? Is that just me?? So what if it takes a few more years, would the hamburg drain effect all of the canals they plan on digging? It seems that you could see the bottom and it would just be a big wishing well.

On a different note, I love everything else..start with the public market: that should be a hit with the downtown workers and the ever growing number of downtown residents. Make it so theres a street side cafe section for people to eat on the run/outside headed back to work or to an event.

And for god sakes...there should be some aspects of this project that should be speculative. The financing is there...I could not find a better example of "if you build it they will come".

You couldn't help but laugh at the "party in the plaza" last week on the news and wonder how much bigger it would be if the public market and larger number of restaurants were available.

Keep up the focus..infrastructure first: canals, water taxi, cobblestone streets etc...but multitasking is a beautiful thing as well..please get some buildings off the ground. It will DO WONDERS FOR COMMUNITY MORALE!!!

I agree about removing the Hamburg drain. I understand it's a big ticket item, but I don't know the cost or the solution. Anyone else know?

They've finally got it right. One thing is missing though (haha); Paint the skyway legs with top to bottom public art. Give me a roller and some lines. And an art director. And a manlift.

start digging so Lindy can hoist the CUP on that bridge

Is there any schedule/dates for when buildings will start?

Is this all there is?... Construction on the canals will begin later this year and will open during the summer/fall of 2012.

It's time to pick-up the pace. Let's go!

- A big hug to the exciting plans!

- Anxiously looking forward to the completion.