City February 18, 2011 10:18 AM

Tear Down These Ramps!

Tear Down These Ramps!
Earlier this week, Buffalo Rising featured the proposed renovation of a wonderful historic building on Niagara Street just north of City Hall (see post).  This is a down at its heels section of Niagara which I thought would not get much if any notice from preservationists and developers for a long time if ever.  It was an extremely pleasant surprise to hear of this project.  The area has tremendous potential but is heavily burdened by poverty, disinvestment, and planned sprawlification locked in by policies set in motion 50 years ago.

The neighborhoods east of the street remain tattered but remarkably intact. Almost all of the historic neighborhoods on the west side of Niagara were removed for new suburban style sprawl developments.  Unlike the suburbs these developments were built to house the poor. Also on the east side of Niagara is the set of giant Thruway on/off ramps which gouge a huge hole in what is left of the street scape, forming a gaping divide between neighborhoods to the north and south.  The giant ramps with associated "green space" were installed in anticipation of a expressway connector which would have rammed a highway through the historic neighborhood at the south edge of Allentown. Little things like historic neighborhoods did not matter to planners back in the 50s, 60s, 70s etc.  Thankfully some miracle the highway connector concept was dropped and Buffalo was spared another epic mistake.

Niageggeg.jpg

Unfortunately we were saddled with the dismembered stubs of this highway at three locations and no one has ever suggested getting rid of them.  I thought about how stupid these ramps are as I read about the proposed building renovation which sits across the street from their east end and how a reurbanization of this area possible.  Even if access to the Thruway has to be maintained here for the convenience of highway users, certainly it could not be too hard to rework them to make the access much less intrusive and destructive to the city.  A smart rework of the ramp configuration could drastically reduce the highway foot print and open up a huge amount of new taxable land to enable a major improvement of the Niagara Street urban environment.  The will to get rid of the highway all together will likely not emerge for many years.  While we wait, why not start chipping away at some of the more silly city killing components of the thing.  These ramps have to go!


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Must be nice to have a convient excuse (planned sprawlification locked in by policies set in motion 50 years ago)for all of Buffalo's ills. That takes the voters and one party rule that the voters have embraced off the hook for 60 years of decline.

Yes by all means get rid of the off ramps so that the thousands of cars passing by will have even less reason or opportunites to pull off and maybe actually visit downtown. Keep the road blocking the water from downtown but make it a through road so that downtown won't be clutered by those pesky people - hell they are probably from the suburbs anyway.

From a post by someone who never fails to amaze with his simplistic outlook this post is truly a new classic.

Score: -17 ( 37 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

did you read the article. he's just suggesting reducing their footprint.

i believe this is what was there before the ramps:
http://wnyheritagepress.org/photos_week_2004/buffalo_pitts/pitts_campus.jpg

replied to Sally
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Lol, I dont see what this picture is supposed to mean at all? Judging by those steam powered canal barges this picture was probably taken around the late 1800's or early 1900's. So being that it was taken fifty years before the the ramps were ever put up I guess I can post another picture of something that has no relevance on what was there before........


http://www.old-picture.com/indians/pictures/Buffalo-Dancer.jpg

replied to sin|ill
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your logic is flawed. people are using the 190 to haul ass out of downtown with no thought of ever getting off at Niagara st to visit any businesses, no matter how vibrant and thriving it may become in the future.

Now, if the 190 were removed and people were forced back onto the city streets, THAT is what will make them stop and visit downtown. Not the oversized on/off ramps.

replied to Sally
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"Now, if the 190 were removed and people were forced back onto the city streets, THAT is what will make them stop and visit downtown. Not the oversized on/off ramps."

Or they would just avoid coming into the city enitrely and get all they need at the many retailers in the suburbs.

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Meh - I don't think removing or truncating these ramps would really have a particular positive impact. They would still be there. The highway access would still bisect the land. And most significantly, the neighborhood will still be just as cut off from the waterfront.

What really needs to be discussed is the future of the entire Niagara section of the 190 through the City. Especially in light of the peace bridge project getting shut down for the foreseeable future.

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Meh for me too. I don't know that the cost of deleting these ramps would get us a good return on our investment. I'd rather see any potential money be injected back into the neighborhoods themselves for revitalization. Assuming it would be DOT money, it could really be better utilized, if it were available.

Also, not to get on a tangent here, but I read again, the article that Steel referenced above, from 2006. Many of the commenters stated that the 190 and Kensington were horrible ideas that cut through and cut off neighborhoods, and that they should be removed. I'm not sure if that sentiment has changed, however if it has not, I wanted to ask, how would people get downtown in a speedy way if not for the 190 and Kensington? Second question is, if the expressways weren't ever built, and the time to get downtown was double what it is today, do you think that downtown would be in better or worse shape than it is today?

While harmful to neighborhoods, I think the value of the 190 and Kensington far outweigh the economic impact we would be missing out on if we were the only major city not to have expressways to our downtown area. Maybe running the 190 along the lakefront wasn’t the greatest idea, but consider the alternative...which would be cutting the 190 through another neighborhood instead of along the water – which is worse?

As always...just me 2 cents.

Score: 6 ( 16 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

hm, not sure tj. Since the highways the city population has been halved followed by a decade or two later the metro population is in steep decline. Can't blame the highways on that entirely but clearly the highways have not been a benefit to the city or region. And if the highways were not built, the population would not be so distant to the core so travel times would probably be little different to access downtown. We would just have a healthier population closer to the urban center contributing to a more active downtown, making the city more appealing to outsiders, making buffalo more attractive to the younger educated population, with less brain drain more small scale start up companies might be located here, two or three becoming one day major corporations, more local wealth, more investment in the city, more disposable income, and a city that is vastly more exciting than it is today. It's all about the snowball effect. (how appropriate is that analogy?) Granted this is all paired with a better more nimble and innovative city government but hey, if they hadn't built the expressways, UB would not be in Amherst, and a substantial strong college age crowd living in the city combined the the university would not stand for the status quo.

replied to tjhorner1
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"how will people get downtown in a speedy way if not for the 190 and Kensington?"

this mentality is why corridors like Niagara St, Broadway, Clinton, William, Main, etc are dead.. because people think they are entitled to be downtown in 15 min or less. Heaven forbid it takes 20-25 and they hit a few stop lights along the way.

replied to tjhorner1
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It might be reasonable to assume that the Buffalo-N MSA would have a smaller regional economy without the super transportation infrastructure - but I would bet that it would have a far healthier and more sustainable economy, with a lot more vibrancy at its core. Downtown might have less newer development, but it would also probably have far greater urban qualities, without so many holes in its smile created by parking lots, off ramps, 1-way connectors, etc.

Conversely, today - when we are becoming less dependent upon highway infrastructure for economic development (manufacturing, shipping, distribution, etc..) Buffalo would be much better prepared for future economic growth, which is becoming less location-centric, and more focused around attractive qualities of life that would be provided for in a healthier urban environment than we have now. This is what we need to be looking at for new economic development. We need to stop sacrificing our natural landscapes and historic urban cores for the benefit of gaining a few jobs - that's only destroying our prospects in the long run.

replied to tjhorner1
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here another idea: REMOVE Porter Avenue ON/OFF access to 190. These ramps are one reason that access to Front and LaSalle parks is off-putting on bike or foot and a BIG reason why semi-trucks are sent up lumbering up historic Porter Ave, rather than a more suitable commercial roadway. I know the precious Peace Bridge would balk like hell at this but, they are going to have to back off soon anyway so, it isn't too soon to discuss this.

Score: 5 ( 7 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

The ramps were built at a time when Buffalo still had industry downtown. That industry is gone and won't return, so we could eliminate the ramps without many concerns voiced from local business or what remains of local industry.

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The crosstown connector expressway (between the 190 and the 33) was fought to a standstill by -- you guessed it -- those damn obstructionists. The story is in Mark Goldman's third (?) book. Although the expressway was stopped, the years of uncertainty took their toll in the planned corridor as properties went vacant or fell into disrepair -- like the present situation near the Peace Bridge.

When the expressway wasn't built, some city streets were turned into connectors in the same corridor: one-way eastbound along Carolina and E. Tupper, and one-way westbound along Goodell, Edward, and Virginia. That westbound connector eventually also included turning Pearl Street near Main and Edward into something akin to an "off ramp" -- resulting in the utterly unnecessary demolition of buildings and disruption of the street grid.

Getting back to the subject at hand, the planned "complete streets" reconstruction of Niagara between Niagara Square and Virginia should definitely include a serious rethink of these 190 ramps. If not now, when--?

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At the very least they should get rid of the high speed turn radius geometry at Niagara and sell of that ridiculous 'green space' for development

Score: 9 ( 13 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

I can see something like that happening, similar to the next few ramps Austin/Hertel.

replied to STEEL
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btw hats off to whoever takes care of all those flowers at the end of the ramp. In the summer it really makes it so much nice just waiting at the light next to giant sunflowers and whatnot.

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Everyone needs to take a look at the Redevelopment Plan for the Lower West Side if you haven't done so. Its a fantastic document with great ideas on how to improve the lower westside and Page 83 specifically deals with what STEEL's article is all about, and includes great illustrations of how to accomplish this. You can get on the 190 down by city hall, and you can travel up to Porter as well. There is no need for 190 access on Niagara St @ Virginia. The Niagara corridor should be reconnected with LaSalle park via a land bridge over the 190, and the ramps should be demolished. Please take the time to read and print this fantastic document and share with friends.

See page 83
http://www.homefrontbflo.org/pdf/lower-west-side.pdf


Score: 0 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

I agree some ramps should be torn down... It is almost too easy to enter the downtown. There is nothing wrong with making it more difficult to leave a sabres game or adding an additional 5 mins to our record low commute times.

The Niagara Ramp is good because it fits into spoke design. I'd rather get rid of the seneca ramp.

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I understand removing these ramps. I don't think it would add too much to commute time.

The problem with our highway system is the number of entrances/exits. It's just too many, and it almost defeats the purpose of Robert Moses's intentions. If you had less ramps, you might be able to increase speed. Why do many towns have multiple on and off ramps?

The 190 would be better suited for the City as a boulevard after it passes the Virginia street exit going southbound. It would turn into a boulevard, travelling down its current path or along a widened Exchange street. The speed limit could be 45mph with synced traffic lights. It can return to a highway somewhere before Louisiana street maybe.

Doing this could remove a couple obstacles: The Seneca street ramp/Skyway to the 190N ramp just south of the Pearl Street Brewery; And the Elm and Oak Street ramps.

It would involve making a new traffic signaled entrace from Church street, and a new Skyway to the 190 South ramp.

Score: 1 ( 3 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

the biggest factor missing in developing niagara street or any neighborhood business district for that matter is the sense of community. businesses and business districts have to serve the surrounding community first, despite obstacles built around them. in niagara's case, there is a large hispanic community and several businesses exist already which serve their needs. the west village is also an important part of this discussion, what are the needs of this neighborhood and how can they create that for themselves? Tops built a new store in the last 10 years, that must count for something...mcdonalds remodeled their store, west end communications upgraded their presentation, latin restaurants are flourishing and a couple are even the type 'you can take a date to'. all seem to have success serving the needs of its community.

now, is it good enough to attract people from different areas to shop or dine, i don't know. elmwood and hertel have done a great job of creating businesses to serve their community first, such a fine job that people from all over want to be there...

the ramps aren't going away any time soon, but i don't think its as big an issue as much as the area has long been forgotten and left for dead. the emergence of the west village, the proximity to allentown, kleinhans neighborhood, d'youville college, downtown, and lasalle park make it a potential gold mine for those willing to reinvest in it.

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Seems a bit silly to debate the merits of a plan to tear down these ramps when no such plan exists. This is not going to happen, not ever, at least probably not in our lifetime.

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I think there may well come a day (as with the Skyway) when the benefits of having the highway do not seem to merit the high maintenance expenses of the 190, especially as the state and country quickly runs out of money to maintain highway infrastructure. But that would involve a consideration of the whole highway, not just a particular ramp.

If the argument is that this ramp is taking up valuable real estate, well... there's a lot of vacant land available in Buffalo that doesn't require demolition of an elevated highway ramp.

replied to NBuffguy
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Well that sounds silly. How would any plan ever come into existence if no one ever started talking about it first.

(spoken with an Italian accent) "Well I don't know Chris " said the king. "No one has ever talked about sailing to to the new world before. Besides, everyone says the world is flat and that it can't be done! I don't think we should do it."

"OK" said Chris "I will talk to the Spaniards instead"

replied to NBuffguy
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OK Steel, if it makes you feel better to daydream about things like this, then be my guest. Whatever gets you through the night.

replied to STEEL
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Before they built these ramps there was an exit ramp to Porter Avenue going north on 190 and an entrance ramp from Porter Avenue going south on 190.

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Are we better off now than when these highways did not exist?

That's an easy question! Our City and County and State are clearly far worse off now than in 1950. These highways did not bring industry to Buffalo; they took residents out of Buffalo. Industry flourished when large equipment and quantities of items were shipped by train and boat.

The highways allowed sprawl to flourish. Taxable land was taken from the city for the benefit of people who wanted to live in suburbs without paying all the costs.

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I have often thought about this issue. I suppose it was just a matter of time before an article was posted.

As with many downtown, lower west side and allentown residents (such as myself), I use the Niagara St. ramp just about everyday. There needs to be a better connection of the streets west of Niagara St to each side of the exit ramps. I truly think that the I-190 ramps into the city could blend into the landscape and not take away from the landscape (as much). We know that Virgina St is the "on ramp" access and the off ramp indirectly connects to Carolina St.

Ideally, it would be great to just get rid of the I-190, but that is probably not going to happen. So, what can we do? We can create a beautification plan for this large parcel of land. This is not going away, so let's at least make it pleasant to look at.

J. Hall

Score: -4 ( 4 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

We CAN get rid of the 190. All it takes is the will. Highways in cities have been demolished from coast to coast. No reason to think it can't be done here. People predicted doom and gloom when New York City's West Side Highway was not rebuilt as an interstate highway. Now there are STOPLIGHTS on the road! And New York is just fine.

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If you're concerned about issues like the Niagara Street Interchange and the I-190, the City of Buffalo happens to be producing the first land use and transportation plan for the city since 1977. NYSDOT is required to take a City's land use plan into account when making investment decisions about the local highway system. Will Buffalo's plan reflect your vision for the future?

Attend the Green Code neighborhood workshops coming up!

http://www.buffalogreencode.com

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Chris:

The zoning code will hopefully be a step in the right direction... But why does the city not play more of an advocacy role on these important issues? Why does the city apparently have no opinion on Canalside? Or the peace bridge project? Or really any of our major infrastructure? I don't remember the mayor's office or Strategic planning uttering a public peep regarding the Route 5 highway that was reconstructed on our outer harbor.

It seems to me that this administration finds it best to be reelected by not saying anything at all, in hopes that it can completely avoid controversy.

Our city suffers because there is no public vision out there. A regulatory code is supposed to reflect a vision, not be the avenue for expression of it.

replied to chris_hawley
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Good idea. Use the fill to help fill in the Kensington and turn it into a parkway. If you agree, see or get the bumper sticker: “TAME THE TRENCH-BURY THE KENSINGTON,” (in “Olmstead Green” and “Clean-fill Brown”) http://www.makestickers.com/addtocart.aspx?SKU=90&DesignNumber=100324085904&cid=she1hz45dncxwnamcmn3n155 (This is an independent site, & I get no money from them.)

Score: -1 ( 1 votes ) Vote up Vote down Report this comment

At one time the 190 and the ramps were part of the demise of our great City. Through the destruction of beautiful architecture, limiting access to the water and making it easy for downtown workers to live in the suburbs.

The momentum has seemed to change. More people recognize the value in a strong core and want to be part of it. Today we can use them to help rebuild part of what was lost. They can be used to deliver people and commerce to our City. If people from the burbs realize how quick and easy it is to get downtown they'll come more. Eventually a percentage of them will think its silly to drive downtown when they can live and shop there. Lets turn the tide and use what once destroyed our city to help rebuild it. Then tear it down!!!

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"They can be used to deliver people and commerce to our City. If people from the burbs realize how quick and easy it is to get downtown they'll come more."

That's exactly what was claimed would happen, when the Thruway was being built. People will be able to zoom in, park around the newly-cleared waterfront, and swarm all over Downtown in droves! Hurray for the Niagara Thruway!

The reality was quite different. Somehow, 'planners' didn't foresee that retail, offices, entertainment, etc would find a way to the suburbs & make 'going Downtown' a needless chore. There were plans to run a highway through Michigan Ave, right through the Oxford/Delavan area, across a corner of Forest Lawn, and on to Tonawanda. All that traffic needed new roads! Well, until all those stores were built in the Sheridan/Blvd areas.

The tallest barrier to change: All that land, including the Expressway, was signed over to Albany. The kingdom of the Thruway Authority doesn't like to give up its holdings, nor to make any changes which might slow the 'flow'.

replied to KGalleries
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When they were built it was about connecting highly populated areas (Cities-jobs) to available land for tract development (suburbs with no concern for what was in the way. Once the jobs and the shopping followed it left no need for those people to come into the city. The money followed the people. If jobs and housing are being developed in the city so will the retail. The thruway can help introduce the city to all those people who work, play and shop in the suburbs. Reverse the flow.

replied to ForestBird
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for those who argue that easy expressway access is essential to the economic health of downtown, how is it possible that the neighborhoods bypassed by immediately adjacent exits (allentown, elmwood, hertel) are the ones with the highest real estate values, healthiest business corridors, and strongest tourist appeal?

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The argument is not they're essential but how to use them to benefit the city. Including making them appealing. These gateways are not going anywhere soon.

By the way everyone of those neighborhoods have expressway ramps within 5 minutes. North Buffalo has Parkside, Delaware, Lincoln Pkwy and Elmwood ramps. All those mansions owners(tax`payers) love the easy access to their summer homes in Canada or the shopping trips to the malls.

The Zoo is a prime example of how the expressways benefits the City. I'm sure some of the restaurants on Hertel and Elmwood see their fare share of patrons who use them.

I love the idea of lowering the speed limit and add a light or two once you enter the city creating more a promenade especially on the 33. This would help reduce the physical barriers they create.

replied to grad94
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a highway entrance "5 minutes" away is hardly the same as one on your doorstep, as is the ramp on niagara. that 5 minute distance shields allentown, elmwood & hertel from the noise, air pollution, and destroyed property values that niagara st. experiences from its adjacent highway.

otherwise, niagara would be the cafe & boutique paradise and elmwood would be the suffering ghetto.

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Tell that to all those home owners on Nottingham and Lincoln pky that have a wonderful view of the expressway. They've lived with all the cars that back up during peak hours creating noise and air pollution. No Buffer there.

I would agree with you on the "gehtto" thing but the poorest sections of the city are no where near an expressway. I doubt the thruway is the overwhelming factor contributing to poverty levels and depreciating housing stock. Last I checked housing values are on the rise at a higher percentage in pockets of the Niagara corridor despite the access to the 190.

Again its not essential to rebirth but a reality that needs to managed in the best possible way.

replied to grad94
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The 190 has certainly devalued and greatly impacted the quality of life here in Black Rock. The highway severed the neighborhoods historic connection to the Niagara River with an ugly, noisy, and polluted highway. A neighborhood asset that had long been appreciated and used for recreation and business was destroyed for the convenience of commuters.
It might be possible to measure the negative economic impact but it is much more difficult to quantify the degradation of environment and resulting quality of life issues. Our waterfront property is a very limited natural resource, highways are a poor use of such desirable and valuable real estate.

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