Protests Ignite Over Kaleidoscope's "Polish Joke"
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"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." - Herbert SpencerI have been following... Read More
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Leave a commentWell...I am a American Pole born and raised in Buffalo.(my grandparents came off the boat from Poland). I think this is an interesting controversy. At one point, yes I think the protestors should see the show. On the other hand, Polish jokes are annoying to me(funny yes) and are also completely false. This play does to some extent completely degrade Poles(I have not seen the play). Buffalo is a unique city in the fact that we are the 3rd or 4th most segregated major metropolitan area in the USA! The problem is that unlike the TV show Southpark(which no nationality is free from being made fun of), this is a play degrading to polish people and I was guess to be based off of a stereotype. I think the play should continue to be put on but, next let's have plays called..."The Irish Drunkard", "The Italian Mafia's", "The Puerto Rican Lowriders", "The Black Fried Chicken", etc... There are some stereotypes as well that would make very funny plays I would hypothesize!! Anyway just my two cents...BTW oldwaiter, nice joke(actually laughed when reading it) but offensive and poorly misplaced here in this topic.
One simple question - HOW CAN YOU BE OFFENDED BY SOMETHING YOU HAVE NOT SEEN? HOW CAN YOU SAY IT "completely degrades" WHEN YOU HAVEN'T A CLUE WHAT THE CONTENT IS? Seriously, you are offended by a two word title? Please, consider this, what if it is a loving portrayal of your heritage laced with wonderful self deprecating humor that would actually elevate the status of the Polish community and assuage some of the stereotypes that so many seem so afraid of? What if that is true and the protests are actually hurting the Polish community instead of protecting it?
But how could you, or they, know any of this since YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE PLAY!
Another wise man once said "Self importance requires being offended all the time." Think about it. And until you actually SEE what you are condemning, your opinions will be hollow.
Solarguy, I am Polish and Irish. I got so offended by the play and your Irish joke that I nearly drank myself into a coma.
HAHA...Like I said, I see both sides...Polish Jokes have grown old...especially since they are unfounded(for the most part)...but the protesters I think need to see the show...Glad you started drinking after my comment...I did as well!HAHA Hopefully people will see both sides soon enough...you can take getting made fun of for so long...haha...but I think this will all blow over soon enough...BTW, Irish and Polish means you can drink beer and vodka equally well.lol
BTW, Irish and Polish means you can drink beer and vodka equally well.lol
wash down your pierogi with some Guinness... :-)
I've always washed down my guinness with pierogis. Have I had it backwards all this time?
I've always washed down my guinness with pierogis. Have I had it backwards all this time?
Is there an echo in here??
This play does to some extent completely degrade Poles(I have not seen the play).
By your own admission, you have not seen the play. How do you know it degrades Poles?
You sound ridiculous! These protesters are looking for a sense or righteousness... just like the women protesting Letterman. How about putting this effort into sending a care package to the US Troops bleeding in the Middle East.
I'm going to start to counter these protest by Reading the 1st Amendment through a bullhorn!
If you don't like the fact that as an AMERICAN it gives us the right to call the play "Never Trust a Pollock*" or "Dumb Pollock*" move to Canada! Maybe if they called the play "Polish Humor" it would have been under the radar? I'd love it if these protesters were actually part of the play and its marketing plan, the joke would be on all of us.
*Is that the proper spelling? I have seen Polock and Pollock.
I'm Scottish - we're the "drunks" of the universe...what the hell is the difference? Holy crap people are so sensitive to every damn thing that is said...
Boo hoo. Their ridiculous actions (protesting a play without ever seeing it) is the only thing perpetuating the stereotype of being "imbeciles, idiots" in their own words. If you can't take a little bit of humor DON'T GO SEE THE PLAY. My family is Italian and German. Should I protest the Sopranos because it promotes a violent stereotype of Italians? Should I also protest any movie involving Nazi Germany because it makes Germans look bad? If any of you protesters are reading this, I am going to go to the play now just to spite you.
There were picketers in front of Time Warner offices in NYC and HBO studios protesting the airing of The Sopranos. They claimed that it perpetuated a negative stereotype of Italians and incorrectly associated Italian-Americans as mobsters.
The Coalition Against Trafficking in Women assembled an ongoing protest against HBO studio's show "Cathouse" claiming that the show endorsed and advocated for prostitution. The protest eventually led to a change in the show.
Protesters in Detroit shut down a stage production of "Porgy and Bess" in 2002 claiming that the show was racist.
and the history of protests goes on and on...
Sure. But how many of those HAD NOT SEEN what they were protesting against?
What we have here is kinda' like those folks that protested against "The Last Temptation of Christ" simply because the Church told them to! And, many years later, many of the same said protestors, after viewing the film, agreed that, had they seen it THEN, they would NOT have carried the sign and walked the pavement.
"But how many of those HAD NOT SEEN what they were protesting against?"
A: All of them. Just like the Last Temptation of Christ (excellent example) the protests were organized based on rumor and speculation and assembled before the plays, movies, or shows were even seen by the protesters.
How many people listened to the Don Imus show before he made his racist remarks last year? He makes a comment and suddenly everyone is an expert on his show and perspective on the world. We live in an over-reactive society of overly sensitive, politically correct, whiners. If you ask me, this is what killed Saturday Night Live and National Lampoon.
Good examples. I think all of those involved are ridiculous cry babies...but good examples.
Wow. Like others have said, it is foolish to protest something that you have not seen! They need to make decisions for themselves, which involves seeing the play first hand and making an informed opinion from there. You can't protest everything that makes you upset.
The biggest joke of all of this though, is that people are actually taking time out of their day to protest a play they have never seen!
protesting something they havent seen - odd how these folks are now the punch line.
I grew up and worshipped in a Polish neighborhood, admire Lech Walesa and John Paul II and the truly great poet Milsoz more than I can say; I even graduated from Canisius College. So I would like to be sympathetic to all sides, but like many others commenting here I cannot understand why or how there would be protesters protesting who had NOT seen the play. Comedy should be an equal opportunity venue to make fun of anybody or any group it wants, genuine comedy, which is normally fiction. A college is perfectly within its rights to stage such a comedy. In fact, it has a duty to stage it. Nobody needs to attend the comedy whose sensitivities are such that he might be offended, by fiction. After all, Canisius is a private college, and fiction is make believe. So far as I can see, the joke is on the protesters.
One more thing...when's the last time you heard a Polish joke??? Aren't we talking about something that was relevant in 1981?
Perry> One more thing...when's the last time you heard a Polish joke? Aren't we talking about something that was relevant in 1981?
Buffalo's a bit behind the times, I guess. Gotta' go ... there's a sale on Members Only jackets and Zubaz pants at the Chess King in Seneca Mall!
Seriously, see Poland today; it has one of the most successful economies of the former Eastern Bloc.
The downtown library could do everyone a big favor and buy the script so everyone can read it and judge for themselves if it is worth A) demonstrating or B) buying tickets.
"deeply conflicted" over his Polish roots? How is that even possible?
The article states, "Throughout the play, the man learns to confront the stereotypes he's grown up with, eventually coming to the realization that he should not be ashamed of his rich heritage."
So they are saying the play addresses stereotypes that have been made about Poles. Degrading stereotypes were made about certain ethnicities during immigration in the late 19th and early 20th century. This did happen. Does the play glorify that? If the quote above from the article is true, it does not do that. It addresses that these stereotypes were made in the past, the character in the play struggles with that and then learns he should be proud of his heritage. In my opinion, that's a great message.
By the way, I am very proud to be Polish American. I performed with a Polish folk dancing company for 8 years and learned a lot about my cultural heritage that way. And I love that my family keeps Polish traditions alive.
I am a friend of Matt and Erin who run Kaleidoscope. They sent a mass e-mail out to their list asking for support for the show, because there was the possibility that the show would be shut down before being allowed to go on (I'm assuming the pressure came from the same folks picketing).
I haven't seen the play either, so I guess my opinion is as good as those protesting against it who also haven't seen it. But I know Matt and Erin. I've known them since I went to school with them at Canisius, and they've worked on several of our films. They're good people.
Oh...and Matt's Polish.
I could never imagine that they'd put on a show that damages his heritage (I'd imagine it does the opposite). Name a heritage that you can't poke fun at...you can't. That's what makes us all unique, and interesting, and human. Except for the Dutch...I can't stand them (thank you Michael Caine for opening my eyes).
But gimme a break...if you're gonna complain about something, go see it to make sure your complaint has some merit.
P.S. Before the Dutch contingent starts blasting me, it's a joke, go see Austin Powers 3.
How many Poles does it take to lead a misguided protest?
zing
Sensitive. Everyone knows blacks are generally not as smat as white. Jews are cheap, mexicans smell, the irish are drunks, and the polish are stupid.
take the kielbasa out of your butts and lighten up you dumb pollacks
- a fellow pole
Q. Why don't polish women use vibrators?
A. It chips their teeth.
ahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
Q: Did you hear about the Polish Helicopter crash?
A: The pilot got cold, so he turned off the fan.
Apparently the name of the play "Polish Joke" is enough to motivate the protesters. Perhaps changing the title of the play is all that is needed? If they are protesting something they have not even seen, obviously the protesters are not asking too many questions.
I hope this does not get any national attention. This protest would just be another embarrassment for Buffalo.
A couple of clarifications for this article, which is biased:
The Chair of Polish Culture at Canisius did call the theater to discuss the play a few months ago. The theater did not return the call.
My understanding is that people were not protesting the production of the play but rather that Canisius College, A Jesuit institution, was the site for the production.
The signs the protesters are carrying do not seem to support your clarification.
Majove,
I'm speaking about the people I knew who had concerns about the play. They did not feel the play was consonant with Canisius' values. I can't speak for the people in the specific photos chosen for this article. I don't know them, nor do I think that every person at this protest had identical opinions about the play, as this article implies.
Whether the play should be performed is not the issue. Anyone has the right to perform a play, and anyone has the right to protest the play and its performance at a venue. Isn't that what makes life in this country valuable?
No excuses and clarifications be damned! Simple semantics. And, quite frankly, it makes the situation and the protesters position even less relatable. ONE phone call goes unreturned and that is justification to run to the Canisus administration and 'tattle' like a bunch of five year olds? And who are 'they' to espouse what values Canisus should and should not have? Are they the Moral Police? Who gives them the authority to question a private institution about the performance of a play that they may, or MAY NOT, have seen? Yeah, they have the right to protest, and I have the right to call 'em on their hypocritical, small minded bullc..p! It's an ignorant attempt at censorship. Nothing noble, nothing more.
I personally like to thank the Am-Pol Eagle for bringing attention to a play, that I otherwise would not have heard about.
dude, people are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYY too sensitive in our society. you can call me a daigo or a guido all you want. i'm proud of my heritage.
"How about putting this effort into sending a care package to the US Troops bleeding in the Middle East."
--- Good call sambo, let's not forget WE STILL HAVE TROOPS ON THE LINE, IN HARMS WAY
At least at this BR site none of the actual owners or administrators appear to be a dopa needing some sort of egotistical recharge by verbally stoning those protesters (simply for being "Buffaloian Polish-Americans"?) without first documenting if they ALL actually ARE either/or Buffaloians and/or Polish-American!!!
I remember the first time I watched "Cheers" and learned one of the actresses was named Shelly Long. Now that's a Buffalo joke if ever there was one...
Eric Oak -
Canisius and Notre Dame have fostered a tradition of hosting persons and viewpoints that encourage public dialog, thereby bringing all to a higher common sense about issues that divide, and create opportunity to identify common ground. This action by the college, your employer, runs counter to that mindset. There are no winners in this course of action, and the narrow-mindedness the play addresses (and overcomes)is reinforced. Canisius, the students, and the Polish-American community all lose. The Jesuit institution has compromised its progressive attitudes by giving in to the narrow-mindedness of a few.
I only have one ethnic joke I like. But I can't remember an even better version which includes the Swiss. If anyone has heard and remembers, please embelish. The joke may not be appreciated, but I like it:
Q: What's the difference between Heaven and Hell?
A: In Heaven, the British are the police, the French are the chefs, the Italians are the lovers and the whole thing is organized by the Germans. In Hell, the Germans are the lovers, the British are the chefs, the French are the police and the whole thing is organized by the Italians.
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So, what's next - the banning of DVD's of "My Big Fat Greek Wedding"? The burning of Joyce's "Finnegan's Wake"? The disembowelment of EVERY Italian themed movie or play ever written? Come on, people! You HAVEN'T EVEN SEEN THE SHOW!
There is the consummate quote appropriate to this situation - “There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation” - Herbert Spencer
Investigate, and then a protest might be recognized as valid. Until then, nothing is happening except the protestors propagating the EXACT stereotype they are supposedly railing against. Ironic, isn't it?